Posted by buttercup26 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 12:42 a.m. (Suggest removal)

my oh my!! mmm hmm mmm!!

Posted by gunther57 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 3:52 a.m. (Suggest removal)

i thought the good ole USA was founded because of religion prosicution(sp?) from england, and land exspantion of different countries to try and rule the world.

Posted by reb1843 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 7:08 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Jenkins needs to go back to remedial US history class 101. I have dealt with the NPS folks before on various War Between the States monuments and battlefields, and they are all PC-indoctrinated to 'spin' the real story.

Posted by beammeupscotty (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 7:18 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Not sure why there is any interest in this. It is time to move on and let this dark side of history go. It is as disturbing to me as the hanging ropes where. Race will always be an issue here because both want to use it as an excuse why Mississippi is at the bottom of the American food chain.

Posted by Incognito (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 7:30 a.m. (Suggest removal)

If we don't study and learn from our history, we're destined to repeat it. Learning doesn't suggest that we dwell there within, but move forward. So, I guess we should also forget that Jesus died a painful death, and rose?

Posted by beammeupscotty (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 7:40 a.m. (Suggest removal)

History repeats itself no matter what. Jesus hasn't managed to end sin so I guess we haven't learned much.

Posted by Incognito (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 7:49 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Of course he didn't end sin. We were all born into sin, however, we can go directly to God through Jesus because of his sacrifice.

Now if as individuals and a society, we don't learn from our pass, then we will never progress.

Posted by beammeupscotty (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 7:54 a.m. (Suggest removal)

What is there to learn from a slave market. People were bought and sold. Maybe we need a shrine to serial killers so we can learn from that also.

Posted by firered (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:02 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Well, personally I think we have "progressed" a very LONG way from the days when slavery was present. I mean come on electricity, telephones, computers, internet, high rise buildings, airplanes, etc. I'm pretty sure that since we are all aware of slavery it will never happen again in the United States. Yes its a part of history, but that's what it should stay, history. Its in the past leave it there.

And I agree with a statement above. I wasn't aware that this country was founded on slavery. I thought the slaves came after the country was founded. Hmm... I guess what I was taught in school (even college) was wrong.. In that case I want my money back. LOL

Posted by firered (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:05 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Hey scotty lets start with Charles Manson... Seems like a good candidate to me!!

Posted by beammeupscotty (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:08 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I can't imagine why anyone would be for this.

Posted by beammeupscotty (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:10 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Manson, Dalmer, Bundy, the list gets very long in a short time.

Posted by firered (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:14 a.m. (Suggest removal)

They wanna be for it because they just can't let it go. And I say they meaning anyone who can't let the past go whether they be white, black, lavender, whatever. I mean what are they gonna do with it? Build it to look like it did back then and have reenactments? I don't think so.

Posted by beammeupscotty (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:28 a.m. (Suggest removal)

It makes me wonder what do the foreign tourists really think of this place. The old houses are nice to look at and to me that is enough of a reminder of that time in history. The battle fields in Vicksburg are a monument to the death that happened on both sides. Too bad people can't let go and understand they are free only by moveing on with their lives. I don't think there are any living slaves or slave owners left in America.

Posted by firered (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:31 a.m. (Suggest removal)

You can't win em all scotty. Unfortunately, there will never be a solution to this problem. Too bad because there is sooo much potential for Natchez!

Posted by beammeupscotty (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:38 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I agree, we have good highways going in all directions now. The river has always been a big plus especially with transportation costs going up. We need a better work force and Co-Lin is working on that. The police need to do something about the drug problem because so many can't pass a drug test. The number one problem for Natchez is "The Race Card". Get over it, there are as many of us poor white folks as there are black.

Posted by itsawounderfullife (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:38 a.m. (Suggest removal)

beammeupscotty im not shure if i agree with this project either but i have worked in the tourist industry in the past for years and the foreigners come here looking for black history as well as indian history which is part of the history here in natchez its not just about the houses its the whole picture.

Posted by Peace007 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:39 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I think the main problem lies in folks not understanding that slavery didn't just began when America was first being built, and also in not realizing that slavery still exists. Slavery didn't just begin with America, slaves have existed at least since Genesis was written...remember Moses freeing his people from the Egyptian Pharoah? Seems we do not learn from past mistakes, because slavery is still happening today in this world. What I don't understand is why people will get so upset over a flag (a peice of cloth), because it is a reminder of days gone by, but will then want a remembrance of a place where people were actually sold? Don't get me wrong, I don't like the fact that people were ever slaves, I just get confused over the issues that rile people up when they don't want to be reminded, but then they do.

Posted by Peace007 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:44 a.m. (Suggest removal)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/specia...

or google: slavery today

Posted by beammeupscotty (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:46 a.m. (Suggest removal)

When you look around Natchez you see several bronze plaques explaining what took place at the site. I think one of those telling about the site would be enough.

Posted by firered (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:50 a.m. (Suggest removal)

That's exactly how I feel peace! Just can't grasp some people's reasonings.

And wonderfull is right people come looking for all different lifestyles, cultures, etc that we have to offer in Natchez's history. There are a lot of positive African American sites here though, like the William Johnson house, and several grave sites in the city cemetery.

Do y'all remember the Mostly African Market that used to be on Jefferson St? Man I loved going to that place. It was very informative. I wish they wouldn't have closed it!

Posted by Peace007 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:54 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Why did they close Mostly African Market, firered?

check this out next time you wish you had diamonds.

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=h...

Posted by justthefactsman (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:55 a.m. (Suggest removal)

For all the people in the city that fought hard and long to get this site recognized as this important part of History..You think you guys could swing by there and cut the grass on a regular basis?? If it is so important to ya'll go out there with your riding lawn mowers and just cut the grass..Quit arguing about who is gonna maintain it..Just like Nike says..."Just Do it"

Posted by firered (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:58 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Honestly I do not know why they closed it. Good question though.

Posted by mike8427 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:59 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I have always wondered why the MS state flag is offensive to blacks b/c it has the confederate battle flag in it, but the public display of a slave market is supported by the black community. I can't think of anything that would be a more visible symbol of slavery, than the slave trading market.

Posted by beammeupscotty (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 9:04 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I think we should give this pink elephant to the National Park Service. The city is broke so why even discuss it. Wonder if there is any chance the city can unload the demolished pecan factory to the Feds somehow.

Posted by beammeupscotty (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 9:13 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Maybe we could show the evolution of blacks in America. Start with slavery then freedom after the civil war, then thru the civil rights movement, then afirmative action and modern day rap music , drugs black on black crime prisons full of young men and women. Not just the blacks but this modern day culture is going to be the death of America.

Posted by rahnia (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 9:42 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Many of the people who came here originally were slaves. The slave trade began before we were a country...the Transatlantic slave trade began in 1440. Also, many of the Europeans coming here were indentured servants for seven years or more. So yes, saying that America was founded on slavery is a valid statement.

Posted by beammeupscotty (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 9:53 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I am a slave my wife beats me when I forget to take out the trash. My children take all my money. I work all the time. If I step out of line the man is there to push me back in. Some are slaves to money,some lusts and others to power. The truely free are slave to none because in their mind they are alone in the universe.

Posted by mike8427 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 10:18 a.m. (Suggest removal)

beammeup - I like the evolution idea, maybe it would enlighten some of the black community to get up and change their lives.

Posted by destiny (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 10:26 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Slavery has always been and will always be until Jesus returns and sets all of us free. Just the word itself should be an abomination for all humans. But it is still here, alive and kicking strong. Every day you hear about it on the news, but it goes in one ear and out the other for most people today. If the true story and I mean the complete, reality was told of what it was all about, people would have a great awakening. Every race is susceptible to this dreaded abomination, be they red, yellow, black, or white and yes, lavender!!!! We as Americans can all be swept up in slavery at any given moment. That is why I beg of you to support the greatest and strongest heros of our time, our armed forces. They are our keepers. They keep us free. Only in our hearts can we invision Jesus, our true greastest hero, but He has placed here on earth the ones He has chosen to fight for our freedom. We can see them, touch, speak to them. They are peace makers and peace keepers. Support them and you support your freedom. Only from our past will be able to be free, but let the true story of slavery in America be told. Not some fanciful story teller making profit from films of this abomination. Would the new slave market tell the true story? I doubt it, for it will still be a money maker, and blood and guts sells at any boxoffice,.not the truth.

Posted by joker980 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 10:32 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Lol @ beamme....good point. But slavery is one of those things of the past that we remember through history just as the civil war. The reason the confederate flag is not liked by most people (black and white) is because it represents a divided United States. Let us all keep in mind we are STILL at war right now, and the representation of us as a country divided isnt very nice to see especially during these times. There are soldiers from the north and the south, black, white and hispanic, male and female fighting and dying for us. So that WE as American people can have the luxury of trying to debate how our history (be it black history or white) will be remembered and those who have died will have not died in vain. I personally thank the slaves , the slave owners, the soldiers north and south, and those who were never acknowleded for carving this path that got the american people to where we are at this point. Without a past how can there be a future? I feel ALL should be remembered. Sept 11 was a bad day, just as slavery was bad. But we all should never forget, this is why we are here. A monument in honor of those who died for our history is common in this country. Why not for slavery? I dont think anyone in this world right now has ever owned a slave or been a slave (other than to the price of gas) so lets let history not divide us but help us realize this " the only thing that is constant, is change'.

Posted by destiny (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 10:36 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Peace007, thanks for the reference link on diamonds. Good example. I read a story about the diamonds once in the Reader' Digest (I think) how they mine these things. They also showed pictures of piles and piles of these rocks laying in storage. To release them all to the public would cause the price of them to drop as low as rhinestones. Would I own one? Not on your life. I'll use sequins for glitter!!!!

Posted by Savage (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 10:44 a.m. (Suggest removal)

The reason why MS and Natchez needs a museum of the history of slavery: because of the people who've made many of these comments. To Americans outside of the South, some of these comments might appear to be anti-black and racist. It's almost as if some people here are pretending that slavery played only a minor role in our city and state - which, of course, is madness - and which is the reason why Mississippi still has a negative reputation in other areas of the South as well as elsewhere in the USA.

Clearly these uniformed commentators could benefit from greater knowledge regarding slavery. And a museum detailing the history and horrors of slavery might be a great help to them as well as to anyone else who is ignorant about the complete history of our city and state.

Slavery was/is a massive part of the history of Natchez and Mississippi - it's what made this city and state among the wealthiest areas before the war. It's what put us on the map. To ignore the profound impact of slavery on the South and and on both white and black Southerners is as illogicial and offensive as is ignoring the Holocaust in relation to the history of Jews. Slavery was/is an essential element in the our history (in this city, state and nation) and by all reason there should be a museum in the USA exploring this fact. Natchez would be a perfect place for such a center as we had the second largest slave market in the USA and as we are already set up as tourist center for the homes of the plantation owners. It could make for a perfect balance. And it would bring more tourists to town and hopefully more jobs as well.

Posted by joker980 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 10:49 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Awesome point Savage....slavery is the reason most of these mansions had the funds to even get built.

Posted by Incognito (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 10:53 a.m. (Suggest removal)

The slave industry was a millon dollar industry, even back in the 1800's. Just think, those businessmen had free labor in which they were able to establish empires. Hmm, sounds quiet familiar with today.

Beammmeup, the lessons I teach are those in which one can pull from those individuals who were subjected to those harsh conditions. Lessons of faith, and perseverance to name a few. To be honest, it would take a long time to go into detail.

Also, there is a huge difference between the indentured servants and the slaves. Please note that the slave were forced to come, the indentured servants came looking for opportunities (yet they were enslaved, but was higher on the social ladder than those who had been forced into slavery)

Posted by Incognito (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 11:02 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Yes fired, we have progressed in those areas you mentioned. However, race relations are not keeping up with the "evolution process". Racial inequality exists in America, and until we as a "United States" learn to embrace diversity, progression will continue to be at a snails pace.

Posted by protectthebluff (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 11:45 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Thank you Savage for that drop of cleverness in the ocean of prejudices !

Posted by Teach4Peace (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 11:58 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Very well written Incognito, the only sense of sense, amongst the postings.

Posted by Teach4Peace (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 11:59 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Savage, kudos to you as well!

Posted by papajeff (Jeff McClure) on December 11, 2007 at 12:27 p.m. (Suggest removal)

rahina:

Go back and check your sources. Transatlantic slave trade couldn't have been established in 1440 because Columbus didn't stumble into the Americas until 1492 (remember the poem "In fourteen hundred and ninety-two, Columbus sailed the ocean blue..."?) The first permanent Spanish settlement in what is now the United States was established in the 1560s (no slave trade yet) and the first permanent English settlement was Jamestown in 1607, with African slaves (and women) arriving in 1619. Many of the early settlers were indentured servants, but most were free men and women seeking religious or economic freedom. Much of the South had plantations with slaves, but the vast majority of Southerners did not own slaves.

I guess my point is that this continent was not settled to expand slavery, and the United States was not founded on slavery. It was an economic situation that developed in a part of the country based on a European demand for cotton, indigo, rice, sugar and other products.

As fas as Forks of the Road, I thought the Kingdom Hall was built on the site several years ago. Do they want the building torn down so some sort of historical recreation can be built? (Just being facetious - I know the market covered a larger area that that). I personally appreciate the desire to preserve our history - the bad along with the good. We live in a very diverse area that has many historical attractions, from Emerald Mound to the antebellum homes to Frogmore to the ancient mound sites in Jonesville and throughout our area. Anything we can do to market our area to visitors and businesses is a good thing. I guess the trick is deciding who will manage what.

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 12:28 p.m. (Suggest removal)

destinys post was good too, but some of the others?????

Posted by noneya (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 12:39 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Travel across the river to Frogmore Plantation....the only tour around that actually shows the slave quarters (and how the slaves lived) as one of it's main points of interest! People WANT to learn and see what the slaves endured. It IS history, like it or not.

Posted by Incognito (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 12:41 p.m. (Suggest removal)

1619 papajeff, I think it was about 20 of them, and if I remember paying attention in class that day (John Hope Franklin, "From Slavery to Freedom), these particular individuals were not slaves.

Papajeff, is it safe to conclude that the American economic system grew and was sustained (to a certain degree) because of this system of free/cheap labor?

Posted by noneya (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 12:43 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Might I mention that is a very good and informative tour? No, I have no ties to Frogmore, but I can see that since people flock to this place, I can see them flock to the Fork in the Road.

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 1:08 p.m. (Suggest removal)

The ppl saying, "forget about it or let it go", sound like the ppl that say the holocaust never happened.

Posted by Teach4Peace (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 1:12 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Yep!

Posted by firered (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 1:13 p.m. (Suggest removal)

The holocaust is a total different ballgame. Slavery was nowhere near as bad as how the Jews were treated. When I said let it go I meant from a racial standpoint. I by no means meant forget about it. It is a very important part of our history and should be honored as such. I just feel that it shouldn't be held against me that slavery happened. Heck, I didn't have any slaves and neither did my grandparents or greatgrandparents. But whatever guess I just probably opened a big ole can of worms that's why I shut up earlier when I did.. Just had to comment on the comment by peace.

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 1:14 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I just cannot believe how dismissive some ppl are. Amazing.

Posted by freedom42 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 1:15 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I just have one quick question. If there had been no black slaves brought to America, how many black citizens would there be today? What are the statistics on immigration from African countries? Were there ever any African explorers sent out to find new lands? Or would those who rant and rave about how badly mistreated blacks have always been be dying of starvation or genocide today?
BTW Incognito, slave labor was hardly free. The owners had to buy the slave and then feed, clothe, and shelter them. HOWEVER, I am NOT saying I approve of slavery. It was/is a horrible thing to do to another human. We all know it still goes on today, and we all know that African tribes were the ones who caught and sold members of other tribes. I think the black community is right in wanting to preserve the Forks of the Road, if just as a reminder of how far they have come, and as a reminder to everyone else how cruel people can be to each other.

Posted by sipboy (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 1:15 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Well if the masses believe the past should be let go, why don't they some of the people to shut down the pilgrimage. Those were homes built by those same slaves that were sold at the Slave Market. So do away with the idea of making the market location an National Park and also tear down those homes that the slaves built: Stanton Hall, Rosalie, Dunlieth, etc...

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 1:17 p.m. (Suggest removal)

True.

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 1:18 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Love the way ppl claim to know how bad it was or was'nt.

Posted by firered (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 1:20 p.m. (Suggest removal)

The Holocaust (from the Greek ὁλόκαυστον (holókauston): holos, "completely" and kaustos, "burnt"), also known as Ha-Shoah (Hebrew: השואה), Churben (Yiddish: חורבן), is the term generally used to describe the killing of approximately six million European Jews during World War II, as part of a program of deliberate extermination planned and executed by the National Socialist regime in Germany led by Adolf Hitler.[2]

That's from Wikipedia... Just wanted to shed a little light on how bad something was or was not....

Posted by firered (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 1:22 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I by no means agree with slavery I think it is horrible. And by my earlier comments I didn't mean to make it seem any other way I just think it is absurd to compare it to the Holocaust.. Sorry if you do not agree.

Posted by freedom42 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 1:31 p.m. (Suggest removal)

firered, the Holocaust was a delibrate murder of thousands of people, many of them Jewish, but also those who were considered mentally retarded, blacks, and anyone who did not agree with Hitler. Slavery was a way of life, and very few people thought it was wrong when it first began.

Posted by firered (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 1:39 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Sorry freedom guess I should've put that next paragraph in there as well to further prove my point (or well make what I was saying clear). Thank you for adding that.

Posted by drawpaintsing (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 1:40 p.m. (Suggest removal)

This is a response to Firered, with no harm intented. In some ways you are correct. Slavery is nowhere near as bad as Holocaust, but it was bad. Africans were stolen from their motherland and brought here to "start" this country. It is the aftermath of slavery that's so terrible. For example, I'm talking about the times when blacks, men particularly, walked the dirt roads and were grabbed, hauled off and hanged just because they were black. I think people get the different eras, slavery and post-slavery mixed up.

I personally think "The Forks of the Road" should be recognized, because it is an esseential ingredient in all this history. It goes in between slaves being brought over here and slaves working the economy and building this country.

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 1:42 p.m. (Suggest removal)

The mere color of your skin, hair and eyes would have gotten a lot of us here killed during the holocaust. Some of us with the preferred traits would have lived because of it. If you don't have these traits your fate would not have been very good. I never compared the 2, never would. Just stated what all of this sounds like.

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 1:46 p.m. (Suggest removal)

There's a reason that history is taught and it's not so that we can "leave it behind". lol

Posted by firered (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 1:49 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Thank you for you response draw. You are very right!

Posted by Morticia (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 1:55 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I believe it will be good and bad for Natchez. It is the history of Natchez and should be included but at what cost to the already fueled fire of the racial divide we have here. None of us participated in this history. But are we ready for the Al Sharptons and others that will come?

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 1:57 p.m. (Suggest removal)

You compared slavery to serial killers. I don't think that's a suitable comparison at all if you want to talk about what was worse that the other.

Posted by beammeupscotty (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 1:57 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Texas has a battle cry "Remember the Alamo". Natchez battle cry will be "Remember the Forks".

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 1:58 p.m. (Suggest removal)

than the other.

Posted by beammeupscotty (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 2 p.m. (Suggest removal)

This will be a gathering place for racial hatred. I didn't compare slavery to serial killers, I compared building monuments to attacks on humanity. So are we trying to glorify slavery by building a monument to it, or do we just like rubbing salt into a wound.

Posted by firered (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 2:01 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Actually I'm not the one who made the comparison.. I made a sarcastic remark about the comparison...

Posted by Morticia (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 2:06 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Scotty - the spoons will be jealous. See, we can't even all agree to disagree and it's not even here yet.

Posted by Teach4Peace (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 2:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Why are WE deliberately forgetting and pretending slavery was a "cake walk?" We went from the VALUE of slave labor, which again, the slaves did cost, BUT THEY WEREN'T PAID ONE THIN DIME towards their FORCED servitude. They were however paid with whippings, beatings, floggings, mutilations, when they tried to run free. They were paid by being totally separated from their families, once in this country to go from plantation to plantation. They were paid by be given some of the worse food to eat. They were paid by the "rags" they were given to work in, in the fields. They were paid by esteeming one before another, "house" slaves then "field" slaves, producing the divide and conquer tactic, that until this day, some say still exists in the community.

I am so tired of the attitude of dismissal, when it comes to what blacks have endured while in this country, while any other group are viewed with courage and actually quite revered. And even after slavery, can someone explain Jim Crow, did that happen or maybe it is also a worked up figment of someone's imagination? Keep telling yourselves that slavery was not as bad, maybe that gets you through this topic. You want slavery and all it's ills to be forgotten and left in the past? My friends, I can tell you it never will, simply due mostly in part to, an attitude of dismissal. As long as you pretend and tell yourself, oh, it wasn't so bad, there's no forgetting.

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 2:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)

The spoons. lol

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 2:11 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Thank you Teach4Peace.

Posted by drawpaintsing (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 2:20 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I know what I said was going to be taken the wrong way. It was just a mere response to Firered. Forget I even said anything. I think about what blacks have been through just about everyday; but instead of me letting it cripple me, I use it to help me.

"Forks on the Road" should be recognized, only for history. If the fact that it will start racial attention will keep it from being recognized, then something else will. And in this area it can the smallest thing.

Once again, forget I even said anything, because I didn't know it will be taken like this.

Posted by Morticia (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 2:22 p.m. (Suggest removal)

That is the very reason it would be good to have - to teach. But it also brings about alot of hard feelings. I think its a great idea but just like the antebellum homes - oh this is part of the house where the servants lived, we all know what that means - it just comes across to some as disrespectful or like rubbing salt in an open wound. Will we ever get beyond it without being accused of being dismissive?

Posted by beammeupscotty (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 2:26 p.m. (Suggest removal)

After forty years in the desert, God told the Jews to get over it. I think a hundred and fifty years is enough for the blacks to get over it.

Posted by freedom42 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 2:29 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Oh drawpaintsing, you opinion is worth just as much as everyone elses on here! Most of us usually disagree with each other some of the time, because we are human! At least I think we all are! LOL But you do bring up some valid points and I agree that the Forks should be reconginzed for its history, just as the antibellum homes, the William Johnson House, the Indian Village, etc. etc. All are part of the history of our land. We can't recognize the good without recognizing the bad also. It just don't work that way! BUT it is all in the past, and we as members of the human race, MUST move forward and get beyond our differences over the past. We must forgive wrong doings on both sides and get on with making this world and our lives better for everyone.

Posted by Morticia (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 2:29 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I have fallen and I can't get up...

Posted by Morticia (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 2:31 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Scotty, valid...however...

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 2:33 p.m. (Suggest removal)

drawpaintsing your post made total sense. Why forget about it?

Posted by freedom42 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 2:34 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Scotty, good point, but I'm afraid it ain't gonna happen.

Posted by firered (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 2:42 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Its ok Morticia I'll help you up! LOL.. and drawpaintsing don't forget what you said at all. It was a very valid point and very welcomed. Everyone has opinions just not everyone agrees. I admire you for not letting your past cripple you but use it to help you! For that you should be very proud!

Posted by Teach4Peace (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 2:50 p.m. (Suggest removal)

No one's past has crippled them. I am from Detroit Michigan, I have never been a slave to anything, but my ancestors were and African slavery in America was an ill-conceived, evil operation to get over, economically.

Posted by Morticia (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 3:05 p.m. (Suggest removal)

We've gone through two world wars, a Great Depression, the Korean war, the Vietnam war, earthquakes and other natural disasters, the Chicago fire, and numerous other acts of God and man that have economically wiped out all races of people since slavery has been abolished. I think if we're economically challenged today it is not because of past slavery at this point.

Posted by Teach4Peace (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 3:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Economically, the FREE labor to pick the cotton, tobacco, and whatever else grew that fueled companies, that fueled the new economy and got things to rollin', even before all of those national occurrences you mentioned, evolved. That's what my economical reference was towards. Who picked the cotton prior to slaves? Couldn't get the Native Americans to do it. They knew the land too well and were too "wild" according to history reports. They were killed off , to SOME extent, basically, due to their non-submissive nature.

Posted by beammeupscotty (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 3:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)

If you think slavery is still holding you back then all the lives that were lost fighting the Civil War were in vain. Which is my point relating to all wars - nothing is gained.

Posted by Incognito (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 3:12 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Scotty, guess what, the Bible tells about life of the past. Should we rid ourselves of the Bible (watch out)? It appears as if you're saying to totally forget. Remember this is a part of American history. Are we afraid to acknowledge this?

Freedom, being honest, do you think that the slaves lived as the "masters?" Feeding, clothing, there's know way the living/housing conditions were comparable. Remember, purchasing the slave was probably considered an investment.

Posted by Morticia (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 3:14 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Thanks for clarifying and for bringing up the group of people you never hear from - the Native Americans. That is one group of people who should be really ticked off by the white man.

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 3:20 p.m. (Suggest removal)

They were royally *%#$%^&*^%.

Posted by beammeupscotty (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 3:21 p.m. (Suggest removal)

To forget is one thing. To forgive is what we need to achieve. So people can quit making excuses for the life they have now. Since no one is alive - slave or slave owner- who do you forgive? I have what I have from hard work because I truly believe all men are created equal. Its what you do with your life that makes an economic and moral difference.

Posted by Teach4Peace (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 3:24 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Oh, there are so few of them, and they by the way, are placed on land, that they once roamed so freely. (Imperialism?) How do you "discover" a place where there are already people? I will agree, and they are ticked off with the white man, don't worry. Also, visit New Mexico and some of the other places they were given, those who chose to live on reservations, you will hear just how happy they are. Again, you obviously applaud them, because they don't make you uncomfortable with the issues their people endured.

Posted by Teach4Peace (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 3:27 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Beam, so are the others on this board. I have yet, in my life, to receive government assistance in the form of welfare, food stamps, TANF, heck, I couldn't even get free lunch when I was in school! So I KNOW about paying my way, working hard each day, and I know the way of the boot strapper. Again, this issue does not stem from anyone believing they are a slave, but it does however AGAIN, stem from people thinking slavery was a cake walk, and perhaps even right, though some will never admit it.

Posted by freedom42 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 3:46 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Incognito, I never said they lived as the "masters". I pointed out that slavery was not free labor. There were certain expenses involved. I may be taken wrong here, but I equate it to this - I never get a "free" ride on my horse. I have to pay for feed, vet bills, repairs to the barn, etc. The slaves lived very poor lives, but probably not as poor as if they were still in Africa. But slavery in America is over, as far as one person owning another. As it has been pointed out, we are all slaves to something. My daughter even has a tshirt that says "I'm a slave to my horse". It's true!

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 3:56 p.m. (Suggest removal)

At least that's a choice she made.

Posted by freedom42 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 3:57 p.m. (Suggest removal)

That was suppose to be funny peace - sorry if I hurt your feelings.

Posted by Incognito (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 3:59 p.m. (Suggest removal)

So now the country should offer an apology and that should heal everything? In God's eye's we are created equally. However, we're talking about man and his limited thinking.

Posted by ijohnson (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 4:01 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Race, once again, blurs our vision.

When you mention racial bias or anything involving the remembrance of slavery as a factor in anything, invariably, you get some white person – we’re talking DECENT people, not the idiots with the bed sheets on their heads like Beammeupscotty – who will look up in confusion and say, “But slavery ended a long time ago.”

Some of us like to pretend that there's tremendous distance between those days and these. But listening to the disrespectful comments, stereotypes, and flippant statements being made on these forums, I am still struck by how little distance there is from then and now.

Indeed, those days are as close to me as to my mother and father, both born in Mississippi in the 1930s. As close as my own birthday when the federal troops were called out to quell the integration crisis in Little Rock, Ark. And, as close as 35 years ago, when there were still laws prohibiting interracial marriage.

So why do some of us treat it as if it were so far removed as to be irrelevant? I think they do so precisely because it is not. Because, somewhere deep, they recognize that it is as near as grandparents, parents and self. Which makes it hard to face without justification, rationalization, defensiveness, guilt? Better to sweep it away.

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 4:08 p.m. (Suggest removal)

freedom. not at all. I understand what you meant.

Posted by freedom42 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 4:22 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Hi, ijohnson! I knew you were going to show up. I guess I'll go now and let you have the floor since I have had my say. I would like to ask you though what exactly do you want people to do about racism, slavery, past history? And I think, my opinion, you were a little harsh on beammeupscotty. I don't see any white sheets floating around his head.

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 4:24 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Well said ijohnson

Posted by beammeupscotty (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 4:27 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Slavery did end long before your parents and grandparents were living. Discrimination however, continues until today. The bed sheets belong on the bed not on someone's head.

Posted by freedom42 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 4:31 p.m. (Suggest removal)

scotty, I would agree with you 100% but I'm not suppose to say anything now. LOL

Posted by Morticia (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 4:43 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Okay, maybe I've had too much wine but the problem with the slavery issue is it really did end a long time ago for everyone including the indentured servants. Lots of people were slaves over the course of America and other countries. The indentured slaves were lied to, the African American slaves didn't even have a choice as their people sold them. None of it makes sense to us who think we own property and animals not people. No one said anything about it being an easy road. It was no easy road. Just look at the history. All of it. People worked hard and most people did not own slaves because they were not rich.

Posted by beammeupscotty (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 4:45 p.m. (Suggest removal)

It appears to me that alot of people in Natchez are suffering from PTSD (Post Tramatic Slavery Disorder).

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 4:53 p.m. (Suggest removal)

beamme have a little sensitivity. That's all i'm trying to do.

Posted by ijohnson (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 5:02 p.m. (Suggest removal)

((freedom42)) Please don't let me run you off if you are one of the DECENT white folks of which I speak. //(*_*)\\

However, in regards to the white bed sheets and beammeupscotty, let's not fool ourselves. Whether virtual or actual, "if the sheet fits?"

As for what I would want people to do about racism, slavery, past history? Well, I want all you Bible-toting, scripture-quoting Christians, and God-fearing folks, to really pray for the realization of Martin Luther King, Jr.'s dream (a better tomorrow and a better America).

Posted by ijohnson (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 5:07 p.m. (Suggest removal)

And, since I raised my right hand and took the oath to fight for our freedom and our country -- and put my life on the line -- as an Army veteran, I don't think that's too much to ask.

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 5:11 p.m. (Suggest removal)

It's not.

Posted by Incognito (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 5:13 p.m. (Suggest removal)

ijohnson, that takes prayer, time, and effort from all involved, In other words sacrifice. Apparently, no one is really willing to make such a commitment.

You'll take care, I'm done with this

Posted by Teach4Peace (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 5:15 p.m. (Suggest removal)

peacerulz, don't BEG or ask anyone for sympathy. I for one am glad this discussion is occurring, simply because so much of what people believe about the South, and some other areas in this country, ARE TRUE. Slavery did happen, regardless to how long ago it was and trying to tag Africans as the ones who sold out other Africans, doesn't lessen the sting. Why did they do this? This in no way excuses, what occurred, on this country's soil. And to the person who said should there be a national apology? Why yes, there should be. It was a horrid institution. Implicating other Africans again, as you are trying to assign guilty parties Morticia, does not make what happened to the African once they were forced into this country, any less.

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 5:23 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Not begging Teach, just asking.

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 5:30 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Or trying to get a point across is more like it.

Posted by Morticia (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 5:31 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Who should apologize Teach? I didn't do it and you didn't receive it directly so you can't accept it. My ancestors did not own slaves. Thats right. My history has been researched. Just alot of hardworking people. I don't assign guilty parties your words not mine. I simply state the facts which are the African leaders sold people into slavery and REsold them when they arrived in the U.S. probably multiple times. A horrible fate for anyone. Can ya hear me now?

Posted by Morticia (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 5:36 p.m. (Suggest removal)

AND... the white women in this country did not get the right to vote any sooner than the black women and the rest of the women for that matter. It was also about 50 years after the black man got the right to vote.

Posted by ijohnson (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 5:48 p.m. (Suggest removal)

AND, Delta Sigma Theta Sorority, a Black group of women at Howard University in Washington, D.C., marched during Women's Suffrage and fought for women's right to vote. So much history, so many oversights, so many people who don't have a clue about our nation's ACTUAL history.

Our history books definitely need to be re-written to include so much of the Black history and Native-American history that was intentionally left out.

Posted by destiny (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 5:49 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Ijohnson of course respect and admiration for any of our armed forces is not to much to ask for. BUT, that does not give you nor anyone else the right to sit here and down grade others as you do with your well versed opinion. You owe beammeup an apology. To get respect, one must learn to give it. Through all your well versed opinions, your biased nature screams loudly. No matter how you phase it, your true nature always shows it's ugly head.

Posted by ijohnson (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 5:53 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Destiny, you need Jesus.

Posted by ijohnson (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 5:55 p.m. (Suggest removal)

THE TRUTH REALLY HURTS, DOESN'T IT???

Posted by Morticia (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 5:56 p.m. (Suggest removal)

So she can direct him to you ijohnson?

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 5:57 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Uh oh, the gloves are on. This may get interesting. It already is what am i saying?!/!?!

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 5:58 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Geez it's gettin' scarrry in here.

Posted by Teach4Peace (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 6 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Morticia, read your posts, you are the one who asked the question, should there be an apology. Again, I made it VERY clear, that I am not a slave, nor ARE you or were you a slave owner, get over yourself, this is NOT about us per se'! It is however, about our ancestors, and what has happened on both sides of the coin. But again, your trying to be far removed from slavery and your sweep under the rug mentality, will keep you in the condition you are in. With a messed up, hateful mind. May God truly save and bless you!

Posted by ijohnson (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 6:04 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Look, all you good people have a good day. My intelligence is really being insulted, the more time I waste with you one-sided, racist/red-necked folks. There's no getting thru to you people.

I will just let you wallow in your hate because I don't want it to rub off on me. So, get back to bashing other Black folks on this forum and poke fun at their English and grammar. Keep on doing what you've been doing.

I need to get back to a more constructive and beneficial use of my time. However, I will drop by and check on you guys every now and then. So, please try and behave yourselves. Because God is watching you.

P.S.: Stop hiding behind your Bibles!

Posted by firered (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 6:05 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Yes ijohnson the truth does hurt doesn't it...

Posted by firered (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 6:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)

wow ijohnson I thought better of you than that.. I'm not even gonna touch that comment. I will just overlook it, agree to disagree with you, and move on to look forward to your intelligence in later forums.

Posted by drawpaintsing (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 6:16 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Ijohnson, I felt the same way you are feeling now about giving up on trying to prove a point and reach people, because they will make you things. I decided to leave this issue alone, because they will never get it.

Posted by ijohnson (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 6:17 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Yeah, firered, see ya later!

Posted by drawpaintsing (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 6:20 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Sorry, I meant to say:

Ijohnson, I felt the same way you are feeling now about giving up on trying to prove a point and reach people, because they will make you say things. I decided to leave this issue alone, because they will never get it.

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 6:23 p.m. (Suggest removal)

So true drawpaintsing.

Posted by ijohnson (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 6:31 p.m. (Suggest removal)

((drawpaintsing and Teach4Peace)) I've been online most the day with like-minded folks who are about positive things and making money. I have several businesses to run. I don't have time for this foolishness.

No, some of them will never get it -- I chose to not argue with fools.

I'm on to bigger and better things -- ONWARD AND UPWARD!!!

Posted by Morticia (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 6:36 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Its funny how everyone is a racist redneck Teach except you. I am hardly a racist. I am hardly a redneck. Its just facts that you keep twisting around. Get over yourself and your racist mentality.

Posted by ijohnson (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 6:41 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Morticia(n) YOU GOT IT TWISTED!!!! Teach4Peace did not call you a "racist/redneck". I DID!!!

I guess that shoe fits . . . THE GUILTY DOG WILL HOLLER THE LOUDEST!!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by ijohnson (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 6:46 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I guess I should have said "the sheet fits!"

Posted by Morticia (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 6:51 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I apologize to Teach. ijohnson you really need to let this go. Not all white people are racist. Everything I said was just history. Facts. Not blaming anyone for anything. Alot of people I have noticed like to blame and take what people say and make it into something else. Don't make people into racists there are enough out there. You have to stop hiding behind your bible and accept people's comments for what they are not look for a hidden racial slur.

Posted by ijohnson (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 6:55 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Mort, get your facts straight, then talk to me.

The facts are all I've delivered on here but you and you're people choose to label me as the "racist".

However, I still love ya'll . . . just be clear about your DESTINY!

Posted by beammeupscotty (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 7:01 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Why should tax dollars be spent on this project? Earlier post stated the Africian Market closed because of a lack of interest. Is the federal government trying to shove this on us? When was a vote taken on the subject? If it means so much to a group of people let them raise the funds to build whatever they want and maintain it. I could care less, life has taught me the attention span of humans lasts about as long as a sneeze.

Posted by Morticia (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 7:06 p.m. (Suggest removal)

ijo, I have always been clear on my destiny, but thanks for the concern. You have to stop judging people.

Scotty, I believe my tax dollars should go to new roads. I think most people might actually agree.

Posted by freedom42 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 7:16 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Well at least we didn't get into throwing rocks and hiding hands. God I hate cliches. You know we all agree in part on the subject, it just comes from a different angle, and NOBODY wants to give up any part of their side and admit that just maybe someone else has a valid point. Now ijohnson, you're telling people they need Jesus, but do you really think He would call people names the way you have?
Remember there were slaves in His day, and instructions on how to treat them in the Bible. Just thought I would mention that. If you want references, (since my Bible is always close to hand) Gal. 3:28, Eph. 6: 5-9, and the whole book of Philemon in which Paul was writing on behalf of the slave Onesimus. But that of course is all in the past. I really think those who are so interested in slavery need to turn their attention to the slavery going on in Africa right now and help save some of these helpless people. I need Jesus that's for sure, and so does everyone else on this forum. Without Him, we would all be slaves to the devil.

Posted by firered (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 7:48 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Very well said freedom. Thank you.

Posted by justthefactsman (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:01 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Do any of you people have Jobs??

Posted by freedom42 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:13 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Sure, we all work and pay taxes! lol But I personally only work in the mornings for money, the rest of the day I get to clean house, clean the barn, do laundry, cut the yard, all that fun stuff. And since I almost always work alone, I spend a lot of time thinking.

Posted by freedom42 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:18 p.m. (Suggest removal)

BTW it is now 8:00, and this meeting was at 6:00. Did anyone actually attend it?

Posted by riverat (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:31 p.m. (Suggest removal)

it is really interesting that very few of the locals were at the meeting tonight..where were the 140 people that blogged? Easy to hide behind the Internet instead of showing up to express your opinions openly..cowards!

Posted by freedom42 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:38 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Riverrat, I am not a coward - I just didn't care one way or the other about the Forks project. They can have it if they want it. Those who cared should have been there. And what 140 people are you talking about? Many of the comments here are by the same people, and some of the people who made comments don't even live in Natchez.

Posted by riverat (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:45 p.m. (Suggest removal)

freedom42.by my count, other than myself, there were two native Natchezians there..the rest of the crowd were transplants. Blogs are great but they serve no purpose for getting people off their butts ..most of these people who regularly blog have nothing better to do with their time...they certainly aren't there to provide real answers to our community's problems...just taking up space..

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:47 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I, for one, am not here on your dime justthefacts. That's all that matters, right?

Posted by destiny (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:49 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Well, I'll be a monkey's uncle. Sat right here for I don't know how long for ijohnson to reply. Leave to eat and she fiannly does. Then leaves again when I return. In case you are still there, ijohnson, as I said the other day, I learned a long time ago to never argue with ignorance. You might be famaliar with a few 4bit words but believe me, that makes you no more than you really are. I have Jesus in my life. If not you would have heard much worse. I constantly pray for temperance, I'll have to thank Him for helping me with that. Also look up in your Bible and see what God tells you about calling other people fools. That is one word that will never be used in my home. I hate to know it's come through on my computer. Just as I told you before, the way down meanness in you will always raise it's ugly head. You have really raised it today. Forget about respect and adrimation, that I mention earlier. I cannot possibly have that for you.

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:49 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Is there a full moon or is'nt it too early in the month for that?????

Posted by firered (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:51 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Glad you care enough to have gone riverat. So how were things?

Posted by peacerulz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:53 p.m. (Suggest removal)

hahahahaha, firered. Good goin'.

Posted by ijohnson (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:57 p.m. (Suggest removal)

((destiny)) I see you enjoy pain. However, I don't have time to inflict any more on you and your gang. So, crawl back under the rock from whence you've come and take them with you. Leave everybody else in peace!!!!

Have a nice life!

Posted by destiny (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 8:59 p.m. (Suggest removal)

hey peace, don't know about the full moon but a few on here today has risen out of the woodwrk.haha./ or crawled out from under the rocks. Most of the time I can shine some people on, but ole ijohnson thinks we should sit here and take whatever he/she wants to dish out, because he/she wants to come across as being so well educated. Education don't mean nothing if you ain't got the class to go with it. Sorry posters, but I've been wanting to vent for several days at that poster.

Posted by ntzmom (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 9:06 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Man, I always miss the juicy stuff!
LOL

Posted by destiny (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 9:06 p.m. (Suggest removal)

You think you can inflict pain. I'd advise you not to go down that road. I know all about inflicting pain. Much more out of you and I'll show you just what pain is. You are the one to crawl back under the rock, but then you know that route very well, don't you? You attact and run under it constantly. Next time stay there.

Posted by freedom42 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 9:07 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Oh destiny, I like my rock! Its a nice agate one with fossils in it. I only come out at night to post and listen to ijohnson vent - usually on me! BTW there will be a full moon on the 24th but it will be a daytime moon rising about 8:45. So we're not even close. Come on riverrat - how was the meeting?

Posted by destiny (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 9:12 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Hey ntzmom, you came in while I'm pounding away on this ole keyboard telling ijohnson that as far as I'm concerned , ha, she done wore out her welcome. haha, been a long time comming. You can grit your teeth jusy so long, and I resent the barbs she has aimed at my new found friends. She might oughta get on now an get backundderthemrocks.haha

Posted by buttercup26 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 9:13 p.m. (Suggest removal)

ya'll know i was really down in the dumps b/c my show (brothers and sisters) is one of the shows that is being affected by this stupid WRITER'S STRIKE! (OR WHATEVER IS GOING ON) but dang!! WHY WANT T.V. WHEN YOU GOT THE NATCHEZ DEMOCRAT ONLINE FORUM!! ya'll should print this mess out and send it to hollywood! I BET I'D BE ABLE TO KICK BACK AND WATCH MY SHOW BY NEXT SUNDAY!!!!!!!
143 COMMENTS ON THIS ON ARTICLE! SERIOUSLY... I LEARNED THE LESSON THE HARD WAY... LOL HOW CAN YA'LL POSSIBLY SEAT STILL READ EVERYTHING THEN GO TO COMMENT ON WHAT YOU HAVE READ AND REMEMBER WHAT YOUR COMMENTING AND TO WHO YOU ARE SPEAKING TOO??? my butt literally goes DEAD sitting here trying to read and comment on it all (haha, that's the hard lesson i have learned)

Posted by ijohnson (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 9:14 p.m. (Suggest removal)

((destiny)) you wouldn't know "class" if it hit you square in the face. Educated BLACKS have always ruffled the feathers of a few of you uneducated bottom-feeders. Glad to know I'm able to oblige 'ya -- getting out of your comfort zone is good for you, 'ya know -- it helps you to grow as a person. So, pray for forgiveness, strength and UNDERSTANDING.

Posted by destiny (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 9:14 p.m. (Suggest removal)

freedom you her good friend'ain'tcha.

Posted by ijohnson (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 9:17 p.m. (Suggest removal)

((destiny)) and anybody else in her gang, IF YOU FEEL FROGGIE . . . LEAP!!!!! lol //(*_*)\\

Posted by freedom42 (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 9:23 p.m. (Suggest removal)

You know it destiny. johnson and I go wayyyy back. We agreed to disagree a long time ago. Usually though she is not this poisionous, don't know what has gotten into her today. Too much stress with all her businesses I guess. I don't get the uneducated part? Aren't you the one who has recently had a book published? Don't I have a college degree and run my own business? I really don't consider any of us uneducated - but maybe she is overeducated! lol

Posted by destiny (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 9:39 p.m. (Suggest removal)

freedom maybe you hit on the nail head. She's just to educated for her own good. Don't you find that in a lot of people tho'. So very well educated, they don't know how to change a light bulb and if they get some one to change it they don't know what to do with the old one. haha.

Posted by destiny (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 9:40 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Hey princess I think she's talking to you now.

Posted by frogprincenessntz (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 10:06 p.m. (Suggest removal)

been rode hard and put up wet today...too tired to even go there..night all

Posted by firered (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 10:45 p.m. (Suggest removal)

hey ijohnson I'm feelin pretty doggone froggy! So here I go. I've kept my mouth shut long enough with you and I'm not gonna tiptoe around you anymore. You sit there and hide behind your Bible all day long yet you spout out falsities and call names and judge others. Well, here I am to set your straight ma'am. You should realize that while you are pointing fingers at all of us take a look at that hand. You have 3 pointing right back at you.. and those hands are mighty unclean from what I have read so far today. I have always been one to respect your opinion and even enjoy reading your posts but no longer is that the case. I have lost respect for you for now because like destiny said if you want respect you have to earn it and to me you just haven't done so. Anyways... I'll be praying for you and for my own anger, forgiveness, strength, and understanding. Have a wonderful HOLIDAY season!

Posted by jayd (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 11:03 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Reading some of these postings, hatred is alive and doing quite well in Natchez. No one touched this and I wonder why? What would we be shown if we looked at the evolution of whites, not only in America, but in the world? Let's go back to the very beginning - start with the first murder in Genesis and proceed to the crucifixion of Jesus, the influx of Europe's misfits, the murder of Native Americans and the stealing of their land, the kidnapping of Africans and selling them into slavery, the deeds and misdeeds done to them, the race of cowards that hid behind hoods (and hide today behind these electronic screens), civil rights as they were/were not, liberty and justice for some. Now fast forward to your serial killers, mass murderers, school killers, pornography, the selling of women and children in sex slave markets, the manufacture and distribution of drugs, the owners of the planes and boats that bring it here, those who buy the kilos to be brought here (even to Natchez), those who get paid to look the other way, those who hire the armies to move it and then send them to jails and prisons for getting caught, incest, the freeing of men for killing men and the punishment of a man for killing a dog, the white rap music market (more whites buy it), the reenactment of a way of life here in Natchez that some can't let go of but others are expected to do so. And on, and on and on. Has either of the races done any good?

I Johnson, you don't owe anyone an apology. Truth hurts. The mayor is not the only one who "plays the race card." Many on here are holding an ace from that deck. Seemingly, we are also into analysis. Who knows about your "ugly head?" Personally, I look forward to reading your posts (and a few others). There's something about intelligent discourse. I detect a bit of jealousy. Education or the lack thereof can cause/contribute to that. You, I'm sure, will understand that. Now, for the record - Jesus did not die to end sin. Jesus died so that sinners (all of us on here and elsewhere) could have salvation if we repent and accept Him as our Lord and Savior. Some of us on here are not there yet. But not to worry, Scotty. Jesus is coming back and sin and those who sin will be no more. Now, God bless all. We need it Lord. Amen.

Posted by ijohnson (anonymous) on December 11, 2007 at 11:15 p.m. (Suggest removal)

AMEN, AMEN, ((jayd)), AMEN . . . YOU HAVE SAID IT ALL!!!! THANK YOU FOR CONTRIBUTING MORE OF THE TRUTH -- I LOVE IT!!!!

Posted by firered (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 12:05 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Just need a little clarification before I say what I have to say half cocked.. Were you talking about only white people in that long list of stuff up there?

Posted by ntzmom (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 12:24 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Let it go firered.
HUGS....
And hey Destiny!

Posted by firered (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 12:31 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Oh well, forget it I think I get what you were saying. So let me clarify a few things for you. Nowhere in the Bible does it say whether Adam and Eve and Kane and Abel were black or white or pink or polka dotted. That influx of Europe's misfits founded this great country that you now reside in. As someone mentioned earlier Africans were sold to the Europeans by other Africans. How about the cowards who are black who hide behind electronic screens as well? And the Black Panthers.. Liberty and justice for some is practiced by blacks as well. And as for whites letting murderers off Judge Lillie Blackmon Sanders is very much a black lady and she happens to let murderers go with a slap on the wrist and having to only serve 3 years. Rememeber the serial killers in Washington, D.C. yeah they were black. I do believe black people participate in pornograpy, they aren't above being mass murderers or school killers. I mean look at all the neighborhoods around here that the crime has risen in. And black people produce the rap music that SOME white people listen to.

So yes you are correct when you ask has either race done any good? I by no means condone the acts by white people nor the acts of black people or Chinese or Japanese or Mexican nor do I think one race is better than the other. We all have our flaws and personally I do no believe race has a dang thing to do with it. It is all in the way we are raised!

Now as for your comments that I did not argue with I do agree with you on them. So hey at least we can agree on something! :)

Posted by lookingout (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 12:48 a.m. (Suggest removal)

People do understand that ALL slaves weren't treated bad?? correct??? There were alot of slaves that were treated very well....Why would African Americans get upset on here it's what they wanted....Isn't that what the artical said??? Why should the goverment fund this?? Why not raise money and do it yourselves?? That is for whoever wants it here black,white,red,green,orange,lavander,pink whatever...Geezzzz...People act like you can go to some peoples home and find a slave there now....I mean people want it then want to get someone else to fund it, keep it clean, and then some want to bit## about it....Either people want it or not if you want it bad enough sale some cakes,cook something to sale on plates...Raise the money!!!

Posted by Teach4Peace (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 7:59 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Good Morning. You people have such twisted minds. The FACT that a person is even a SLAVE is wrong. Treating slave "good" is an OXY MORON. They should not have been slaves to begin with and we are talking about black folks in this post. Africans were kidnapped from their country. As far as I am coincerned, MOST other races either came to this country of their own accord, and may have had to live in abject poverty, but that is a far cry from the packed ships that stacked Africans on top of one another, to haul them over the Atlantic. Does the Atlantic Slave trade mean anything. Not to some of you. Trying to "lessen" or "brighten" the institution of slavery again my friends, is foolish. But to admit that it was a horrible institution, that should have never happened and one that had its very foundations in evil, inflicted upon a non-deserving people, is the right step in the direction toward race relations and healing, for everyone.

I feel sorry for some of the people on this board, especially if you are employed and work with blacks. I feel sorry for the blacks whose faces you stare into each and every day, because if they only knew of how you really felt about them and their ancestors, they would do what they could to get rid of you, or rid themselves of you. Makes me wonder, how many whites I encounter on a daily basis that may think just like some of you, the only solice is, I KNOW they are still alive today, which is why racism with continue to exist.

Progressive thinkers, enjoy your day, I am through with this one. My many posts were FACT filled and I have NOTHING to prove to intolerable bigots.

Posted by freedom42 (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 8:38 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Well good morning all! Cain should never have murdered Able either, but he did and now we have murderers running amok. Lots of things have happened in THE PAST that should never have happened, let's get over it and try to move forward. Remember the past if it affects you, learn from the past if you can, but don't insist others hold your past in the same honor as you do. I'm going to work now for some of my hard earned money to spend on my horse!

Posted by Glad2BOut (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 8:55 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Willie Lynch - ipjohnson - it doesn't take much effort to discover Willie Lynch is a HOAX http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Willie_Lync......

"No provenance for the speech has ever been supplied, and the text as given below contains numerous anachronisms ("self-refueling", for example, since the word "refueling" dates only to the early twentieth century, or "fool proof", a word not attested until the early twentieth century). For these reasons, along with others, historians such as William Jelani Cobb of Spelman College consider the Willie Lynch speech to be an internet hoax.[4]"

hmmmm, Who would gain from perpetuating the idea that slave owners 300 years ago are the reason for lack of ambition today????

ipjohnson, are you too lazy to look this up yourself? OR you blindly believe everything Farrakahn says? OR you know its false, but find it convenient to advance your goals?

Posted by kpage (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 9:14 a.m. (Suggest removal)

No folks, we should not forget slavery or any moment in history when people were persecuted. My folks came from Italy where they worked in the boss' fields and were treated cruelly. They came to America for a better life and still were treated cruelly. Still they persevered and many of my dad's family are well-off today because of their struggle. I feel if the United States had listened to Jefferson Davis, President of the Confederacy, the attitudes we read on this forum would not be expressed as they are. He said the U.S. had no rights to free the slaves with no future in their sight. He said to educate them, teach them to read and write, how to manage a household and acreage, etc. I feel it was foolish to keep a person enslaved to doing a specific job, then let him go and to fend for himself. They were prevented from learning anything new and setting the slaves free with no education was detrimental to their freedom. What good is freedom if you have no money, no food or home? Teach them, said Jeff Davis, or this country will suffer for it.

I am in no way "rooting" for the Confederacy or singing its praises, but what the man said is true. The white man freed the slaves then turned his back on them. Of course they were on the bottom of the economic ladder and in some areas, still are. But why? Of course the slaves wanted freedom, but they needed a little help surviving in a country who didn't want them anymore. They did the best they could considering their lack of knowledge, that which was kept from them while enslaved. I feel African Americans have come a long way in this country and am glad they are part of our "melting pot". It's just a shame that our cultures are so far apart that it's hard for us to understand each other. Why judge one culture by the standards of another? Both sides are guilty of this and until we can judge only ourselves within our own culture can healing begin. The bottom line is blacks don't think, speak, act, react, etc. like white people and vice-versa. We are different in these areas but alike in that we are human beings trying to make a living in America.

Posted by thetruthhurts (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 9:15 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Why does everything always get turned into a race issue.... unreal.... you are ALL unreal...

Posted by thetruthhurts (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 9:20 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I tend to agree kpage. Thanks

Posted by thetruthhurts (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 9:22 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I am so tired of being made to feel like I owe somebody something, when I have done nothing!!! If you like living in the past so much, why not invent a time machine and go back in time and hound the ones that did it.... Tell my great-great-great-great ancestors hello for me...

Posted by kpage (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 9:22 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I'll reiterate Rodney King's plea, "Why can't we all just get along?"

Posted by kpage (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 9:25 a.m. (Suggest removal)

truthhurts, we do not owe anyone anything, do we! Well, I guess we could learn to be tolerant of others. Maybe if everybody learned tolerance we would get along better.

Posted by thetruthhurts (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 9:38 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I try my best to get along with everybody.... but the taste of blood in my mouth from biting my tongue, was gagging me.... sorry....

Posted by thetruthhurts (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 9:43 a.m. (Suggest removal)

obviously some will always feel like the "white man" owes them, for something us nor them had anything to do with..... It truly makes me ill to think of slavery, but I didn't do it.... ya know? It's an excuse and its an OLD excuse...

Posted by america39120 (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 9:50 a.m. (Suggest removal)

THE HOLOCAUST IS A HOAX!!!!!!!!!!!!!

at least that is what some people would want you to beleve. if what Willie Lynch say is a hoax, why is it true? it appears to be true wouldn't you agree. everything he spoke about they practiced. ijohnson did not make that up. face it ........you folks are evil and will do whatever you can to clean your filthy hands of all the messes you have created in the world.....then and now.

you people are a bunch of delusional idiots. so self serving. so stupid.

truth, i didn't hear anyone say you or we owed them anything. no body asked for respect, a pat on the back, a handout. as a matter of fact, i haven't heard anybody ask for their 40 acres and a mule they were promised. you need to get a clue. do us all a favor a chew you tongue clean off because you have nothing positive or sensible to even say. you self rigtous bigot.

Posted by thetruthhurts (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 10 a.m. (Suggest removal)

oh great.... Wondered where you had went to.... NOT

Posted by kpage (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 10:03 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Now who's being a "self rigtous" (ha) bigot? Why is truth being bigotted by speaking how she feels? If you go back and read our posts you will know how she feels. Stop being defensive and open your mind to a little tolerance and acceptance, <<<america39120>>>?

Posted by thetruthhurts (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 10:12 a.m. (Suggest removal)

thanks kpage... but we have history, america and I.... We have agreed to NOT LIKE each other.... he/she gets off on telling everybody crap and calling names... very mature don't you think?

Posted by america39120 (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 10:13 a.m. (Suggest removal)

kpage, i read her posts and she just told us how she feels. "I am so tired of being made to feel like I owe somebody something, when I have done nothing!!! If you like living in the past so much, why not invent a time machine and go back in time and hound the ones that did it.... Tell my great-great-great-great ancestors hello for me..."

well i sure wish i could dig them up. i would whup their a** and make them give me what i'm owed. i would make them right all the wrongs they did to the blacks and indians and i would put their butts on these plantations you people are so proud of. i would work their a** to a bone then throw them away to be forgotten. i would buy silver spoons to put in my kids mouth that i bought with their blood, sweat and tears. then i'll tell their torn and tattered kids to get over it. and while i'm at it-----i will make sure they can not get a job or a education because i don't want them to be smarter than me.

yea, i wish i could turn back the hands of time to. i bet you would be singing a different song *miss truth*.

Posted by eagles (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 10:14 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Hey you, don't jump to conclusions. Who said truth was white? She is entitled to her opinion, as are the rest of us. Back off.

Posted by thetruthhurts (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 10:15 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Just do some research on he/she comments... Last time "it" went to threatening everybody and had everybody changing their names.... so I am ignoring.... now.

Posted by thetruthhurts (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 10:18 a.m. (Suggest removal)

aawwww... boo hoo... cry me a river....poor you...

Posted by america39120 (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 10:18 a.m. (Suggest removal)

kapge, you say i shoudl open my mind to tolerance and acceptance. i have. i have tolerated yalls ignorance too long and i have accepted the fact that some people and some things never change. that's why america's image is tarnished....right here in 39210.

Posted by thetruthhurts (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 10:20 a.m. (Suggest removal)

39210? Knew you were from another planet...

Posted by america39120 (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 10:21 a.m. (Suggest removal)

hey eagles, is she black? if she is, that doesn't change that fact that she is stupid and a bigot. bigots come in lavendar too, right.

Posted by thetruthhurts (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 10:22 a.m. (Suggest removal)

God bless you america39120. Have a wonderful day and holiday..... If you wish to argue, you would have more luck if you actually made sense.... You don't have to "tolerate" this bigots ignorance any longer... chow....

Posted by eagles (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 10:23 a.m. (Suggest removal)

What exactly are you "owed", america? I'd also like to know why you are "owed" something? What gives any of us the right to think someone else owes us anything? Nothing.

Posted by thetruthhurts (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 10:24 a.m. (Suggest removal)

anyway... In case any of you sane people are interested... I am Indian.... does that mean I am owed something??? I want mine too!!!

Posted by america39120 (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 10:25 a.m. (Suggest removal)

see ya!!!!! i look forward to chatting w you later. have a blessed holiday. don't tuck your tail and run tho just because the heat is on. you came on this post this morning with a chip on your shoulder. now that it has been knocked off you want to run. have a good day.

Posted by kpage (anonymous) on December 12, 2007 at 10:26 a.m. (Suggest removal)

truthhurts...did you notice america's bigotted remarks? That's what you've been talking about and it ope