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Is casting a vote just a matter of looking in the mirror?
Published Sunday, August 24, 2008
NATCHEZ — Former Natchez mayor Phillip West has seen the progression.
During the first eight years of his 17 years on the Adams County Board of Supervisors, he was the only black man on the board.
“It took the U.S. Department of Justice and redistricting to get another elected and that was Thomas “Boo” Campbell in 1988,” West said.
From 1980-1997 he said he experienced a lot of racial tension.
When he left the board and joined the legislature from 1997-2004, he said he still saw clear racial division.
“There are always issues that come up from time to time, whatever arena you may be in, where race issues are the No. 1 determining factor,” he said.
West said he was shocked in 2004 when he was elected as the first black mayor of Natchez since Reconstruction.
“It was something that I never anticipated nor expected,” he said.
And now, he’s on his way to serve as a delegate for the first black presidential candidate in the history of the nation.
Another ex-mayor mayor, Tony Byrne said he’s not surprised that Barack Obama is such a viable candidate for U.S. president.
“It shows how far race relations have come,” Byrne said. “We’ve come a long way.”
And though the nation has come a long way and Obama is a qualified candidate, local officials believe his qualifications may be lost under the color of his skin.
Can we be color blind?
West said votes that come along racial lines exist and it is the cold, hard truth. He’s experienced it himself and said it’s hurt him.
“It’s always hurtful to everybody when voting is prioritized based on race 90 to 95 percent of the time,” he said.
“That’s been my experience in my area, and it used to be 100 percent.”
David Breaux, head of the department of political science and public administration at Mississippi State University, said racial voting is undeniable.
“There’s definitely racial voting,” he said.
And Natchez Alderman James “Ricky” Gray said that’s just the way people’s minds are wired.
“Everything we do in life, the bottom line is gender and race,” he said.
West said sometimes, more important issues are sacrificed because of skin color.
“Many people will vote against their own interest based on race, and it’s just a fact,” West said.
Breaux said race won’t necessarily displace other issues, but it may be the extra factor that helps a voter swing from one side of the fence to the other.
He said people will vote for candidates that they strictly feel comfortable with.
“I think (voters) use some shortcut rules or mechanisms to arrive at those kinds of decisions,” he said.
Often, voters are comfortable with the incumbent or with someone who is a typical Republican or a typical Democrat.
He said this election is unusual though, because neither of those deciding factors is clearly present.
“You don’t have an incumbent (and) you have two candidates who aren’t seen as being in the mainstream of their party. (John) McCain is seen as a maverick on the Republican side, and Obama is not the typical Democratic candidate,” Breaux said.
Without an incumbent, the voter wants to grab on to something else. This time around, race is an easy hook.
Race is such an apparent factor that Breaux said the candidates don’t even have to address it.
“It’s so obvious they don’t need to spend a lot of time and energy on it,” he said.
West said, however, he thinks the candidates are walking on eggshells around the race issue.
“It is a (top issue) they try to dance around on TV all the time, but it’s the major determining factor in this election,” West said.
Of course, not every voter will vote along race lines, West said.
“I think there are a few people, a small minority, that have grown beyond that,” he said, but it’s a minority.
Former Natchez alderman Theodore “Bubber” West said he fits in the minority.
“Race is not the primary focus,” he said.
And Gray is hopeful race won’t be the determining factor.
“Close your eyes and listen to the issues and then open your eyes back up and vote for the ones who bring the best (solutions,)” Gray said.
He said with what’s going on in the nation, it’s not about black and white.
“You’ve got blacks, whites, Asians, everybody hurting,” Gray said. “This shouldn’t be a black and white issue but who can do the best to bring country out of what we’re in right now.”
The Rev. Clifton Marvel, vice president of the Natchez branch of the NAACP, said he’s happy the first legitimate black candidate is one who is qualified.
“It’s very fulfilling as a black male to see the day when a man of color would be recognized for what he is,” he said.
Alderman West said he never thought he’d see the day when it could happen, though his parents always told him it would.
“I’m proud to be alive in a time where it’s possible,” he said.
Marvel said it’s not something that just happened over time.
“This progression is a result of blood, sweat and tears on behalf of some of white America and all of black America,” Marvel said.
Comments
Posted by Swapmeet (anonymous) on August 23, 2008 at 11:48 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I said it in the national news story at the bottom of the home page, but I will repeat it here. Why is race such a big deal in this race? Obama is not even black, or African American, depending on how you say it. Obama is half Kenyan and half Caucasian. Saying that people will not vote for him because he is black is not true seeing that he is not black.
Posted by Swapmeet (anonymous) on August 23, 2008 at 11:57 p.m. (Suggest removal)
When I said "Why is race such a big deal in this race?" in my previous post I meant "Why is race such a big deal in this election?". That will make that sentence sound clearer.
Posted by Peace007 (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 12:09 a.m. (Suggest removal)
The Republicans would like Obama if he were the Republican candidate. But this is what I truly believe...In the primaries, the Republicans voted for Obama hoping that he would get the nomination over Hillary. That made Obama look as if he were much more popular. Since then you've seen his numbers go down and that's because the numbers were originally fake. But as time goes by and the lies told by the McCain campaign are brought forth, Obama will look much better even to the Republicans.
Posted by Swapmeet (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 12:14 a.m. (Suggest removal)
A lot of the primaries are closed Peace meaning that only registered Democrats could vote for Obama or Hillary.
What lies of McCain's are you talking about?
Posted by ebony (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 12:19 a.m. (Suggest removal)
You are 100% correct Swapmeet. Obama is not black!
Posted by Peace007 (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 12:27 a.m. (Suggest removal)
http://harryallen.info/?p=349
Read this article Swapmeet.
Posted by Swapmeet (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 12:33 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I read the article, but I must say the website loses credibility with me when it says "I'm gonna get you sucka" as a photo caption. Is it possible that he has this to a certain degree? Maybe. Do I think that just about anyone who has been to Vietnam could possibly suffer from this in some degree? Yes. Do I think it affects his qualifications as president? Not at all. His willingness to sit in a POW camp for six years shows me his integrity.
Posted by scarlettohara (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 12:39 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Hey Peace,
The more I learn about McCain, the more I detest him. Before he became the Repub. candidate, I'll admit that all I really knew about him was that he was a war hero. I had respect for him and admired him for what he'd been through.
Unfortunately, when you put yourself out there in the spotlight, as he has now, we all get to see the ugly flaws, as well. I have very little respect for him now on any level. While I will always have respect for the fact that he did serve his country and that he was a POW, that's where it ends. Other than that, I wouldn't waste spit on him.
Barack Obama would not have been my first choice for the Democratic nomination, but he is so far superior to what the Republicans have to offer.
How ANYONE could truly support McCain baffles me!
Posted by Swapmeet (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 12:55 a.m. (Suggest removal)
(Posted by scarlettohara: How ANYONE could truly support McCain baffles me!)
With all due respect, I would make the same statement about Obama, scarlett. Here are just a few of the reasons why I can't vote for him.
1. He opposed a bill that would give the right to health care to infants who survived abortion procedures saying it would undermine the mother's original decision. He also is in support of partial-birth abortion. The following is a medical description of partial birth abortion: "Intact D&X, or partial birth abortion first involves administration of medications to cause the cervix to dilate, usually over the course of several days. Next, the physician rotates the fetus to a footling breech position. The body of the fetus is then drawn out of the uterus feet first, until only the head remains inside the uterus. Then, the physician uses an instrument to puncture the base of the skull, which collapses the fetal head. Typically, the contents of the fetal head are then partially suctioned out, which results in the death of the fetus and reduces the size of the fetal head enough to allow it to pass through the cervix. The dead and otherwise intact fetus is then removed from the woman's body."
2. He admittedly has friendly relationship with and sits on a board with William Ayers, a domestic terrorist who bombed the U.S. Capitol, NYC Headquarters, and other buildings and said he didn't regret it at all.
3. He sat under the preaching of Rev. Wright who desecrates the Lord's pulpit by spewing hatred. Obama said he could no longer disown Rev. Wright than he could the black community or his own grandmother. A week or two later he did just that for political expidiency showing he'll throw anyone under the bus to better his position.
4. He has questionable dealings with Tony Rezco who was a slum lord in Chicago. He took contributions from this man and had an acquaintance with him while he was under federal indictment.
5. He wants to increase federal spending by $1 trillion dollars.
6. He supports homosexual marriage.
7. He supports nationalized healthcare which is just a first step down the slippery slope to socialism.
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 1 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Race relations have come a long way and they would go a lot further without discussions like this. My parents were less racist than my grandparents. I'm less racist than my parents. My children show almost no signs of racism at all, but it takes a concentrated personal effort. It is a goal achieved by private generational example passed on to children and not via multiple public controversies created by people like Phillip.
I know Phillip, Tony and Bubber well enough to know that Tony and Bubber are speaking the truth and aren't racist. In fact, I know many of the West clan and none, except for Phillip, has ever, to my knowledge, exhibited racism. I know Phillip is racist because he admitted it in a public forum in response to a direct question that I asked. He helped destroy the public school system in Natchez with a racist court case. He is also being disingenous when he states that he was "shocked" to be elected mayor...he never would have run if he didn't think he would win. The man has made a career by being a racist provocateur.
As regards the national election, Obama is the only candidate that has injected any racism into the race whatsoever, which is a double standard...it's OK for him, but if someone else goes there they are immediately condemned. He is as hypocritical as Phillip and it is quite fitting for Phillip to be one of his delegates.
I'll never vote for an Obama type...give me Condoleeza, Colin or Michael Steele. They've reached their pinnacles due to merit and have abstained from playing the race game. The Natchez Democrat should do likewise.
Posted by ntzmom (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 1:46 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I have no clue as to who to vote for in this election.
I feel like these two are both awful.
Posted by rattlesnake (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 3:55 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Swapmeet, Great post! You hit the nail on the head with this one.
Posted by harvest1 (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 4:50 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Decisions will have to be made soon, and I know some have already made up their mind, but the country will decide in Nov. who will be our President. To all- their choice is better than the other. I hope it can be better in the future than it is now. I pray that wise decisions are made on our part. God Bless All.
Posted by jrn59 (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 6:35 a.m. (Suggest removal)
One question will help you decide who to vote for President? Who can keep me safe from terrorists? They are still out there and waiting to see who wins and they are very afraid of McCain, so some have said. For all the Bush haters, here is your question: have you had a terrorist hit since 9/11?
Posted by adamstanton (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 7:49 a.m. (Suggest removal)
What a joke when I read that Obama is such a better choice than McCain, and why is that because he delivers a few good speeches he can get his groove on better, the volume of work and information about McCain is over a long period of time and with Obama every day seems to bring something new that we didn't know because he hasn't been around any time at all really. Another thing if you look at the results of the voting especially the voting along racial lines Obama carried the Black vote in one of the Carolinas at a 92% clip of black voters that kind of percentage is unheard of in politics. Had White people voted for Hillary along the same racial lines as blacks did for Obama he would be a has been, never was, in this election. Is voting as simple as looking in the mirror so far this election has proven that answer to be yes if you see a face in the mirror similar to Obamas'.
Posted by mike8427 (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 7:55 a.m. (Suggest removal)
JM59 - Have we had a terrorism hit sice 9/11? Have you noticed there is a war in Iraq & Afghanistan and everday our soldiers are fighting terrorist? At least once a week there is a bombing in these zones, how come when a US soldier is attcked, you think its not a terrorist hit?
Keep in mind it has been over 5 years since Bush declared an end to major operations in Iraq, somehow neither the president nor some people will acknowledge that we are still fighting a war and Americans soldiers are being attacked by terrorists.
Posted by sentas (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 9:07 a.m. (Suggest removal)
4,146 soldiers have died in Iraq - a place that presented no immediate danger to us and was unconnected to Al Qaeda. And in so doing, our great country has compromised its ability both to fight those who DID attack and and protect against other instability in the world (Iran, Korea... Russia?).
Jrn59 - it's a lot more complicated than your question implies.
Posted by fatherof4 (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 9:36 a.m. (Suggest removal)
There are probably just as many blacks who vote for a candidate because he is black, as there are whites who vote aganist a candidate because he's black.
Posted by jrn59 (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 9:43 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Mike8427: the terrorists have been in Iraq, not here. You vote your way and I will vote for Senator McCain and I hope Mitt Romney. Good luck if you are on SS, needing insurance, better wages, cause Obama loves the 60's (except the Beetles) & wants to revert back.
Sentas: no complicated question, vote whoever you want.
Posted by sobeit (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 10:19 a.m. (Suggest removal)
fatherof4
Didn't you know that a white voting for a white because he is white is racist but a black voting for a black because he is black is NOT racist? Go figure.
Posted by southernlady1776 (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 10:35 a.m. (Suggest removal)
The problem I have with obama is his heritage considering we are in a war... secondly I question his loyalty to this country... It is not hidden fact that he will not recite the pledge of aligence nor will he place his hand over his heart... every candidate who runs for office has recited and placed their hand over their heart... why does Obama refuse to do this?
He is all over the map on important issues he never sticks to his story... at this point his seems shady untrustworthy and I would be terribly concerned that if we had another terrorist attack that he in fact would not sell us out to the enemy... I get the feeling we can expect racial lines to be drawn and immigrants will be pouring in by the boat loads.. just what we need...
I am not saying either are the best one for the job but I would have to vote for McCain over Obama... everyone should know by now that they always spew forth all the garbage we want to hear and when their tail hits the office chair all of that flies out the window and they do as they please.... everyone is entitled to vote for who they wish.. Im just terribly worried about the future of our country with Obama.
Posted by fire39212 (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 12:22 p.m. (Suggest removal)
CAPITAL GAINS TAX
>>
>> MCCAIN
>> 0% on home sales up to $500,000
>> per home (couples) McCain does not
>> propose any change in existing
>> home sales income tax.
>>
>> OBAMA
>> 28% on profit from ALL home sales
>>
>> How does this affect you?
>> If you sell your home and make a profit, you
>> will pay 28% of your gain on taxes.
>> If you are heading toward retirement
>> and would like to down-size your
>> home or move into a retirement
>> community, 28% of the money you
>> make from your home will go to taxes. This
>> proposal will adversely affect the
>> elderly who are counting on the income
>> from their homes as part of their retirement income.
>>
Posted by fire39212 (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 12:23 p.m. (Suggest removal)
INHERITANCE TAX</ SPAN>
>>
>> MCCAIN 0% (No change, Bush repealed this tax)
>>
>> OBAMA Restore the inheritance tax
>>
>> How does this affect you? Many families
>> have lost businesses,
>> farms and ranches, and homes
>> that have
>> been in their families
>> for generations because they could not
>> afford the inheritance tax.
>> Those willing their assets to loved
>> ones will not only lose them to< BR>these taxes.
>>
>> NEW TAXES BEING PROPOSED BY OBAMA
>>
>> * New government taxes proposed on
>> homes that are more than
>> 2400 square feet
>>
>> * New gasoline taxes (as if
>> gas weren't high enough already)
>>
>> * New taxes on natural resources
>> consumption (heating
>> gas, water, electricity)
>>
>> * New taxes on retirement accounts
>> and last but not least....
>>
>> * New taxes to pay for socialized medicine
>> so we can receive the same
>> level of medical care as other
>> third-world countries!!!
Posted by fire39212 (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 12:24 p.m. (Suggest removal)
DIVIDEND TAX
>>
>> MCCAIN 15% (no change)
>>
>> OBAMA 39.6%
>>
>> How will this affect you?
>> If you have any money invested in stock
>> market, IRA, mutual funds,
>> college funds, life insurance, retirement
>> accounts, or anything that pays
>> or reinvests dividends, you will now
>> be paying nearly 4 0% of the money
>> earned on taxes if Obama become president.
>> The experts predict that 'higher
>> tax rates on dividends and capital gains
>> would crash the stock market yet
>> do absolutely nothing to cut the deficit.
>>
>> INCOME TAX
>>
>> MCCAIN (no changes)
>>
>> Single making 30K - tax $4,500
>> Single making 50K - tax $12,500
>> Single making 75K - tax $18,750
>> Married making 60K- tax $9,000
>> Married making 75K - tax $18,750
>> Married making 125K - tax $31,250
>>
>> OBAMA
>> (reversion to pre-Bush tax cuts)
>> Single making 30K - tax $8,400
>> Single making 50K - tax $14,000
>> Single making 75K - tax $23,250
>> Married making 60K - tax $16,800
>> Married making 75K - tax $21,000
>> Married making 125K - tax $38,750
>>
>>
>> Under Obama your taxes will
>> more than double!
>> How does this affect you? No explanation
>> needed. This is pretty
>> straight forward.
Posted by fire39212 (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 12:24 p.m. (Suggest removal)
www.phforamerica.com
Posted by USMBOY (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 1:18 p.m. (Suggest removal)
what do you all think about this video?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c-q4MDQ0c...
Posted by tcauthen (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 3:58 p.m. (Suggest removal)
usmboy try this one
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4FCNKwHRC...
Posted by happyreader (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 4:50 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I'm a fairly conservative, young white woman who usually (not always) votes Republican. A few months ago, I was thinking to myself that we were in a win-win situation regarding the Presidential election. Obama was more liberal in his spending plans than I would have liked, but at that point I would have been at peace with him in the White House. Plus, I thought that maybe, just maybe, if an African-American was to be elected to the highest office in the land, it would go a long way to heal race relations in our country - which would be wonderful.
Then the "Reverend" White quotes hit the news. I find it so personally hurtful and disappointing that Obama was a member of this congregation for years where such hateful things were preached and where the crowd responded with cheers instead of outrage. Whether Obama was personally there or not when the comments in question were made, it's insulting to our intelligence to ask us to believe that Obama didn't know the views of his trusted mentor and congregation. This speaks volumes to me about his personal character and causes me to lose what trust I had begun to place in him. It makes me very sad, because I was hopeful that he might help our country get past race-baiting... but it seems like he isn't particularly offended by it.
Posted by dragonflyday (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 5:29 p.m. (Suggest removal)
does anyone remember what obama's wife had said about America, i'll vote for MCCAIN any day,cause i'm not going to vote for someone whos not proud to be an american,no matter what color....
Posted by jenniferh (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 10:08 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I agree with you dragonflyday - Michelle Obama definitely needs to be watched closely. She has some views that are decidely un-American. Anyone who wants to research should check out www.michellemalkin.com. I really like what she has to say.
I really dont feel comfortable voting for Obama because he just doesn't have the experience the next President of the United States needs. I also don't feel that he exhibits the American patriotism that I want my President to show. Where is his heart?
And lastly, I have always voted for either Democrat or Republican. But this election I am very seriously considering voting Idependent for Bob Barr. I just really like what he has to say, so far. Ntzmom check it out. Just a suggestion.
Posted by Teach4Peace (anonymous) on August 24, 2008 at 10:15 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Dragonflylady, you along with SOME not all Americans TOTALLY misinterpreted Mrs. Obama's statement, conveniently so. To look into that comment and believe that Blacks have had it good in this country, especially as history dictates, would be to look into what she really meant when she made that statement. This country has NOT been good when it comes to inclusion and it just depends upon WHO you ask. Yes, you ask some, they will say wow, I have had a great life, so would their ancestors. You may ask others and get a totally different answer. We are not talking about immigrants who came to these shores willingly. Again, I really want us all to move and progress beyond history, but we are doomed to repeat it if we don't LEARN from it. Obama sealing the Democratic nomination was also a period of time for me where I also felt, maybe someone with skin color like mine, just might finally be accepted into society as the leader of the free world. Not because his skin color is brown, but because he is also just as experienced as G.W., or McCain for that matter. I mean, experience and G.W., what an oxymoron, pun intended. Obama is highly intellectual, projects reason, and with time would be fantastic. NO matter who wins, NO ONE will fix this mess coming out of the gate, it will take time.
Posted by Peace007 (anonymous) on August 25, 2008 at 12:01 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Sen. Obama believes a focus on the middle class is appropriate in the wake of the first economic expansion on record where the typical family's income fell by almost $1,000. The Obama plan would cut taxes for 95% of workers and their families with a tax cut of $500 for workers or $1,000 for working couples. In addition, Sen. Obama is proposing tax cuts for low- and middle-income seniors, homeowners, the uninsured, and families sending a child to college or looking to save and accumulate wealth.
The Obama plan would dramatically simplify taxes by consolidating existing tax credits, eliminating the need for millions of senior citizens to file tax forms, and enabling as many as 40 million middle-class filers to do their own taxes in less than five minutes and not have to hire an accountant.
http://online.wsj.com/article_print/SB12...
Posted by dragonflyday (anonymous) on August 25, 2008 at 12:01 a.m. (Suggest removal)
teach4peace, you are going to back obama and thats your right to,just as well as it's mine to back mccain.you see things in a different light and so do i. like for one thing, i don't believe in abortion's , well obama is for that, i love my right to bear arms, obama not so. well i will say this and you take this any way you like, indians had their land and way of life taken from them,then they were forced to live on reservations,now you don't hear them complaining day in and day out. in africa they still have slavery to this day,you don't hear them either, so tell me why is it an african-american can complain here in america and they have every opportunity out there for them,and you can say they don't, but look at obama ,he did it,and all others there before and after him. i would like to know how is it that by electing a black man or what ever he's claiming to be, is going to move america forward. call me blind , but the only thing that will do, is make history as america's first black president,thats it. and thats not because of me being prejudice,thats me stating the facts. now for g.w. thats a joke, our young men and women are dying and for what,it's not just for oil thats for sure.
Posted by dragonflyday (anonymous) on August 25, 2008 at 12:28 a.m. (Suggest removal)
yes teach4peace i want us to move forward to but how can we if every day we are reminded about the past and what happen. the past is what it is,no one can change it. we can better ourself by opportunity, look i'm not saying a black man has no right to be president,just don't use the fact he is black just to get a vote or a battle going,cause he is a black man going against a white man. to me thats being perjudice,when color is the only thing thats running the race. hope you can see what i'm talking about.
Posted by mike8427 (anonymous) on August 25, 2008 at 7:40 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I keep hearing people say that Obama has limited experience since he has only been a U.S. Senator for, what 3 years. But what nobody has said is that our current President had very little experience also, maybe less than Obama in Federal governement. President Bush was govenor of Texas before being president, he had no political experience beyond the state level.
Posted by Swapmeet (anonymous) on August 25, 2008 at 8:31 a.m. (Suggest removal)
(Posted by mike8427 (anonymous) on August 25, 2008 at 7:40 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I keep hearing people say that Obama has limited experience since he has only been a U.S. Senator for, what 3 years. But what nobody has said is that our current President had very little experience also, maybe less than Obama in Federal governement. President Bush was govenor of Texas before being president, he had no political experience beyond the state level.)
The big difference is that being a governor is having executive experience. You are actually running a government at that level and Texas is quite a big government. That's why Clinton dodged the inexperience bullet in '92. Obama has never been governor. State senators don't run much.
Posted by mike8427 (anonymous) on August 25, 2008 at 8:38 a.m. (Suggest removal)
That is true swapmeet, I do recall that Clinton was in the same boat with experience.
Posted by happybunny (anonymous) on August 25, 2008 at 9:24 a.m. (Suggest removal)
The fact of the matter is this, there are a lot of balck people that will vote for Obama simply because they percieve him to be black. That is racism at it's finest.
I will not vote for him because I disagree with everything that comes out of his mouth. I have done my homework and am making a well educated choice.
Voting is a responsibility that should be taken very seriously and unfortunately it's not. You hear countless stories of the Dems busing poor people in to vote at every election and I'm sure this one won't be the exception.
Posted by Teach4Peace (anonymous) on August 25, 2008 at 7:47 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Please, comparing the NATIVE American to the African (experience) brought )(by force) to this country is NO comparison, other than both cultures were dessimated, also, trying to bring up slavery continuing in Africa is NOT the premise of the discussion, this discussion was touching on slavery in America dealing with the Negro and slavery and the classes who benefited. You are perfectly well in voting for who you would like, just as I am, but lets not bring up pseudo case and points to justify hidden agendas.
Posted by Teach4Peace (anonymous) on August 25, 2008 at 7:51 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Happybunny, why is it white folk will not vote for Obama because they don't agree with his stance, yet you and your kind believe some black folk to be lesser intelligent so they have to vote race? What scientific poll have you conducted to confidently post such a statement? That is a total insult to every clear, conscious thinking black person out there. I've got news for you, not everyone black is voting for Obama. I know you hate that, but check out his venues lately? I hardly see blacks there. Just oceans of white folk who happen to agree with his platform. Are they voting for Obama because he is black?
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on August 25, 2008 at 8:42 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Teach4Peace...I agree with you, the "clear, conscious thinking black person" is voting for McCain...granted it's a minority, but they're used to that and have no fear of voting against the majority...maybe Obama needs, uh, a token black person at one of his rallys?...sorry, your argument just left you vulnerable in so many ways.
Please get over the "oppressed black person" syndrome, it's not becoming, it's counterproductive and just like so many minorities that have overcome and thrived (some later rather than sooner) like the American Indian, Japanese, Chinese, Vietnamese, Scots, Irish, Germans, and on and on, why can't blacks assimilate? Heck, even the illegal Latinos are assimilating better than some American black folks simply because they won't let the hate go.
White guilt over slavery and black condemnations of all white folks for slavery (very few white folk's ancestors were slave owners or even remotely associated with it) is only helping racism and not killing it like it should be killed. What have black folks gotten from their efforts while enslaved? The ability to say they helped build this nation from the ground up and the ability to take advantage of the opportunities they helped build. Too many aren't grasping that opportunity and would rather complain and condemn.
Yes, there are white folks who won't vote for Obama because he is "black" just like some black folks won't vote for him because he is "white", it is the height of ignorance to vote or not vote on that basis. I won't vote for Obama because he is just too liberal. If Condi, Colin or Michael Steele was running I'd be saying where do I get in line to vote for them. Not for their race or lack of commonality with mine, but because of their political sense!
I may regret my words because I don't know how Condi or Colin are going to vote because they haven't said so, but I do know Mr. Steele's point of view. I wouldn't vote for Allen Keyes anymore than I would have voted for Pat Buchanan, Ron Paul or the like...they are too extreme just like Obama. Shoot, give me a conservative black Democratic candidate to vote for and in Tom Scarborough's words..."I definitely might". I think I'm pretty safe for now though, the only conservative Democrat isn't any longer and will be speaking at the RNC...LOL.
Posted by Teach4Peace (anonymous) on August 25, 2008 at 9:51 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Again, you pick the portions that are all too convenient. I knew in typing my post someone would think I feel that even TODAY, blacks are still oppressed. Don't be silly, blacks have come a long way and for most of us, thanks to OUR effort and hardwork, NOT a handout, so I don't have a black oppressed issue I need to lose.
The fact remains and what's so beautiful about living in this country is, as I watch this Democratic convention, in America, white and blacks are embracing Obama! He won't win the presidency with the black vote alone, which proves my point, not only are some blacks are voting for him, but he has the ability to pull together the masses, not keep us divided.
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on August 25, 2008 at 10:22 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Teach...what's "all too convenient"? What isn't truthful? I'm not suggesting that you got a handout. You have obviously come a long way both personally and as a people and you have helped build this country. How exactly are you oppressed or is it perception?
My wife has a problem sometimes when we go to a "hoity toity" event...I'm not even sure what that means or how to spell it, but I have to remind her that there is no one there that is better or worse than she...a lot of times it's a mindset.
The fact remains that you are being deceived not by conservatives who hold many of the values you have written so eloquently of, but by the liberals who talk the talk, but don't walk the walk. Conservatives aren't cookie cut. There are things I don't agree with the conservatives about, but it's like choosing a church...I want a church that allows me to worship in my way, not the way a government tells me to.
Do you want more freedom or do you want the government to tell you what you can and can't do, take your money if you're successful and be a nanny for those who refuse to be productive? Free the people, don't buy into the Obama BS...it's simply not true!...he is THE most divisive candidate in years, he is simply flying under the radar...and I thought Hillary was bad.
Posted by Teach4Peace (anonymous) on August 25, 2008 at 10:34 p.m. (Suggest removal)
The last 8 years have been testimony enough, to the carnage reeped by your so called "conservatives." I laugh everytime I hear that moniker because most of them are everything BUT conservative. They throw around buzz words to keep you lulled away, just as you feel Dems lull away blacks. Gun control, abortions, etc. and have you to believe that all Dems are against gun ownership, for abortion, etc., when this is just NOT true. Also, I don't get "free the people BS" from Barack, that is elementary. What I do get from him is that this country needs a new direction and it does. Perhaps when you have tallied up these past 8 years, you see nothing but glowing and shining accomplishments.
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on August 25, 2008 at 11:42 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Teach...I asked for specifics and you are spouting generalities and Demo talking points...I understand that you're fired up from watching the DNC...I watched it too, yawn...I'll rebut point by point if you'll participate and answer the questions...I'll answer yours...how fair is that? I'll go to bed now and allow you the last word tonight...see you tomorrow!
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