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Project tears at Wis. Indian tribe
Published Friday, April 25, 2008
NATCHEZ — While the Grand Soleil moves on in its construction, a tribe of American Indians in Wisconsin is facing animosity, financial whiplash and opposition in the wake of their decision to partner with the casino.
The Lac du Flambeau Band of Lake Superior Chippewa Indians has invested financially in the Grand Soleil Casino Natchez project.
The tribe agreed to help fund the project and in order to do so, they secured a bond that, according to tribal council member Brooks Big John, they initially thought would only be $30 million.
When the bond was voted on Jan. 2, an additional $20 million had been tacked on to help pay for the Grand Soleil.
The council voted to accept the bond, but Big John did not, as he was leery of it, he said.
“The entire council, when they decided to sign onto the bond Jan. 2 was not fully aware of the repercussions and totality of bond indenture itself,” he said.
He said the 210-page document was never fully explained to the council and they never received any consultation.
“That’s why I voted no on it,” Big John said.
The bond got enough votes to pass, however, and now the tribe is feeling the consequences, Big John said.
“It’s brought us to our knees,” Big John said. “We’re struggling to make our pay periods every year, we’re struggling to pay our bills.”
The tribe owns a casino called The Lake of the Torches in Lac du Flambeau, Wisc. and according to Big John and tribal member Bill Poupart, revenue coming in from the casino is being used to pay off the bond.
According to Poupart, who said he has reviewed National Indian Gaming Commission documents, revenue from the casino is broken down in a way that 69 percent is supposed to go back in the tribe.
Carl Edwards, tribal council member, said all casino revenue from the Lake of the Torches is forwarded to the tribe in compliance with the Indian Gaming Regulatory Act.
It’s conflicting reports such as these that have caused a rift within the tribal council and tribe itself.
Essentially, the tribal council is split in half — those who support the casino project and those who don’t, or at least have become suspicious of how its funded and if the money is being handled legally and ethically.
In the meantime, according to Poupart and Big John, in an effort to “trim the fat” to be able to pay back to this bond, there have been severe cutbacks and lay offs from the casino.
“Some of our leaders try to mention it’s business as usual,” Big John said. “In my eyes it’s not business as usual.”
“Our people are crying for help and crying for recognition. We’ve never seen layoffs and firings to this nature before.”
Edwards, said there have been no cutbacks or job terminations from the Lake of the Torches.
Big John said this split is all because of this bond agreement, which wasn’t issued entirely to fund Grand Soleil but that is a majority of it.
Poupart said the tribe is surrounded by smoking mirrors, too. When tribal members ask for financial projections or any kind of information of the project, their requests are ignored.
“They still aren’t giving us any information on what’s going on,”
Poupart said. “We’ve asked for financial projections on the Natchez casino and they don’t share them with the other council people.”
Big John agreed that all their requests have been denied.
“To this day we have not seen all the financial contracts, market studies, feasibility studies, just a few people have been privy to it,” Big John said. “If you keep withholding information, you get to second guessing and doubt that leaves a bad taste in a lot of people’s mouths.”
This friction between the tribal members has caused a rift that is becoming violent on the reservation.
“Because of this Natchez project, it has split our community right down the middle,” Poupart.
A takeover took place on March 26, where a group of protestors stormed the tribal center and attempted to set up camp in protest.
They were chased by the police and ended up hiding in another building for fear of what the policemen would do to them, Poupart said.
Realizing what was going on, the community began to rally around the few protestors who hid in the building for 13 hours.
Poupart said 300 people were outside the building in support of those on the inside, camp fires were lit and drums were beaten.
Policemen called for reinforcements until nearly 100 of them stood by the crowd.
A group of 20 or 30 supporters began walking toward the building where the protestors were camped out and the police assumed they were storming the building.
“The cops freaked out and started pepper spraying people and turned the fire hoses on the people as well,” Poupart said.
He said several people ended up having to go to the hospital.
Edwards said the takeover is currently being investigated by the county’s district attorney, as the takeover was illegal and confidential documents were stolen and copied from the tribal council office.
Two or three weeks ago, Poupart said those opposing the tribal council right now set up a fire, which they call the “sacred fire.”
“It’s a protest and a show of solidarity among people,” he said.
The fire is watched 24 hours a day and has been blazing since the day they lit it, despite efforts to put it out by those resenting the protestors.
Edwards said the 20-some protestors are politically charged as it’s election time and that they do not have the support of the tribe.
Poupart begs to differ, as he said though the group may have 20-outspoken members, they have much silent support among the tribe.
Despite what is taking place in Wisconsin, Bill Bayba, president of Grand Soleil, said the conflict will not affect what is taking place in Natchez.
“They’ve been good business partners,” he said. “Whatever the inner workings are, it’s really immaterial to the Grand Soleil.”
He said the casino is working in accordance with Mississippi gaming laws.
“Everything is moving along,” he said.
Comments
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 12:22 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Peace and prosperity. It is such a lovely thing.
Posted by frogprincenessntz (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 1:04 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Wrong answer Mr Bill Bayba. You sound just like the condescending Obama. It is immaterial to you what the common people think, as long as you get what you want. You are so much above them that their wishes and wants do not matter.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 5:58 a.m. (Suggest removal)
You would think indians would know better than to sign treaties with white men by now. They must have quit teaching history on the reservation as well as in the public school system.
Posted by freedom42 (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 8:22 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Well, we can't say we haven't been warned!
Posted by whataboutit (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 8:41 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I agree with you frogprincess. Mr. Bayba now has the white man (Mr. Cato) and the indians against him with that inmaterial remark.
Posted by dia4sw (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 9:01 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I'm a partner in numerous business ventures with Mr. Bayba. It is not common practice or appropriate for any developers to become involved in the personal business affairs of any of their investors.
Posted by whataboutit (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 9:17 a.m. (Suggest removal)
A tribal counsil split is a little bit more than "personal business". As common practice goes he should have made no comment rather than tag it as "inmaterial". You being a partner dia4sw is really irrelavant.
Posted by Hardcorps (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 9:26 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Ugh! Sound like heap big screwjob Kemosabe. Bayba Huey might better start circling the wagons and watching for puffs of smoke.
If the American Indians had had better immigration policies the white devils might not be here. I agree with EnKiKur about the treaties. I'm more than 1/4 Native American and I'm thinking about putting on paint.
Gen. George Armstrong Bayba may need to rethink some things.
Posted by dia4sw (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 9:42 a.m. (Suggest removal)
That would be "im"material - whataboutit. And a comment of "no comment" most likely would receive even more comments. My partnership is relavant as to my knowing the good business character of this developer.
Posted by whataboutit (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 10:11 a.m. (Suggest removal)
some people can be IMpossible. Sorry for spelling the word wrong. Best to you in all of your business dealings with people in general.
Posted by whataboutit (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 10:38 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Sorry, Council split not counsil split. My bad again.
Posted by Dd (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 1:11 p.m. (Suggest removal)
EnK-
"If the American Indians had had better immigration policies the white devils might not be here. "
Whether it was intended to be funny or sarcastic...it's displaying your ignorance,and has nothing to do with the subject.
Your claim is 1/4 Native American?
How about instead of posting your trash ..pick up a book and educate yourself on your heritage.
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 1:50 p.m. (Suggest removal)
How can it be immaterial when Mr. Cato has sued the tribe. My understanding is that the tribe lost a lot of money on two other failed casino projects and as a desperate attempt to increase its asset value, devalued Mr. Cato's portion of the Grand Soleil thus prompting the law suit.
This project is in much deeper trouble than is being publically admitted. From all accounts the tribe is on the verge of a civil war. My prediction is that the tribe will bail and the majority ownership will be sold to another investor.
Posted by whataboutit (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 2:19 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Is Mr. Cato suing the tribe and owner of Grand Soleil? It was my understanding from the ND that he (Mr. Cato) was suing Mr. Babay for not being paid yet from the new owners. Which I guess, monies for Mr. Cato's part may was to come from the tribe. I agree Sam, this project is in much deeper trouble than is being publically admitted. Glad he thinks the tribe is "good business partners" but shows little concern for the fact that it is tearing the tribe into. I guess as long as when it splits, the greater of the split is the ones who want to pay the bond.
Posted by White_Niiji (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 2:29 p.m.
(This comment was removed by the site staff.)
Posted by whataboutit (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 2:40 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I am sure this will get twisted as having nothing to do with nothing, but is it not just a little sad that a city as ours, named for the Natchez Indians now has businessmen who are involved in the splitting of another indian tribe. Oh I know the city is not responsible for any of the things going on with this tribe, it's just a little strange. But then stranger things have happened around here. :(
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 3:10 p.m. (Suggest removal)
White_Niiji (what does the name mean, just curious)...what do you think of my prediction?
Are you simply a concerned member of the tribe? It's the Ojibwe correct? Are you affiliated with the protesters that occupied the tribal council building? Need to know whether your concerns are yours or propaganda from an interest group.
It was my understanding that the "Dream Catcher" wasn't the only "economic development" project that failed. What about the casino that the Bureau of Indian Affairs quashed?
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 3:20 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I'd like to think that one of my previous comments on an earlier story brought this to the attention of the Democrat...am I correct?
Posted by whataboutit (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 4:12 p.m. (Suggest removal)
What in the world was in that article that it needed to be removed? Was he not who he claimed to be? Shed some light on that one. This is just too confusing, there was no bad words, gosh.
Posted by whataboutit (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 4:27 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Come on site staff....what was it for crying out loud?
Posted by ogitchidaa (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 4:33 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Niijii means friend in Ojibwe. So what I guess that means was "White Friend"
I didn't get to see what they wrote, but I am sure that it was something that one of the partners down south did not want out in the open. Partners meaning Bill Bayba or one of his cronies... One of my comments got deleted the other day, and I am sure that I said nothing offensive either. The things that people do not want discussed in the open are the issues that should concern you.
Posted by whataboutit (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 4:42 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Sam watch what you say....since that article was removed you may not want to take the credit. You have any clue why it was removed?
Posted by ogitchidaa (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 5:22 p.m. (Suggest removal)
IF you have any questions, send them to ldfnews@gmail and they will be glad to tell you what info they can.
Posted by freedom42 (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 5:40 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I have always been on the side of the Indians! They have always gotten the bad deal since Europeans got here.
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 6:18 p.m. (Suggest removal)
No...I'm astonished...there was no cause that was apparent from the post itself...the staff of the Democrat needs to explain or reinstate the post!
Posted by White_Niiji (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 9:31 p.m. (Suggest removal)
My comment mentioned a lawyer affiliated with the tribe as well as some comments about a business man and tactics similar to organized crime. I am a tribal member and not affiliated with the group opposed to the current administration, although I share their views. We have been lied to by these elected people so often, they don't even know what the truth is. I also have intimate knowledge of the investments made by these people (Starting with the Dream Catcher thru Natchez and XIT). I will acknowledge Mr Bayba is a very good businessman. His interest are not the same as the tribes nor should they be. We must watch out for our own interest and unfortunately that is not happening as it should be. This is why we have lost over $65 Million in the last 6 years. Lost through poor investments. You have to work pretty hard to loose that much money, especially when we have borrowed all of it.
Mr Bayba speaks for him self and his interest. We have no representative in Natchez to speak or act on our behalf. That is simply bad business on our part.
We hope to change this very soon...if it is not too late already
Posted by White_Niiji (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 9:39 p.m. (Suggest removal)
There was not take over as Mr Edwards asserts. There were tribal members protesting their government, inside their tribal buildings. Buildings they own. You cannot take over your own house. The DA is investigating this but has not filed any charges. They are also investigating Mr. Edwards, Dee Mayo, Weeders Brown and Chairwoman DOud. But...no charges have been filed against these people either. So, we shall assume all parties are innocent until proven otherwise.
Posted by OldGrandDad (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 9:52 p.m. (Suggest removal)
sammohon, What is that you say? "Follow the money..."?
Posted by White_Niiji (anonymous) on April 25, 2008 at 10:01 p.m. (Suggest removal)
We have followed it as far as the records go. However, guess who guards the records?! Yes, the current administration. This is exactly why the Ginews asked for a forensic audit of the tribal books. The current administration claims the hard drives for the computers holding this information were taken by the Ginews. This was physically impossible as they were searched by two separate law enforcement agencies when they came out from the tribal offices. If they had this information, they surely would have given it to those agencies. So, the question I want to know is who has it and what was on those drives?
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on April 26, 2008 at 8:54 a.m. (Suggest removal)
OldGrandDad...that's right
Posted by ogitchidaa (anonymous) on April 26, 2008 at 10:04 a.m. (Suggest removal)
There are approx. 3500 tribal members total. We have a constitution that is supposed to be our guiding light. There are around 1700 members that are of voting age. According to the constitution and bylaws, anything expenditure over $10,000 is to go to referendum vote. Not one dime going into this project was ever put up for the people to decide, and the majority of decisions were made by Carl Edwards.
His most recent decision was to give our voting rights to this project to Bill Bayba. We have no say so in where our money goes or is spent. See why Bayba says the things he does? If the ND deletes my comment because they think it is not factual, they need to check this fact with the Mississippi gaming commission.
Would your city government get away with something like this? Would you citizens not rise up in protest? I hope that your voices join with ours over these wrongs. Because if you don't and these people continue in the same way they are doing things in Wisconsin, our problems are soon to be your problems. If they aren't already. Were you aware that most of the construction people were brought in from out of town? How is that for being friendly to your new neighbors.........
Posted by ntztransplant17 (anonymous) on April 26, 2008 at 10:24 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Someone please explain to me..........how does this effect the Natchez project? Why is the tribe upset about the Natchez casino? I guess I'm just dumb, but this needs an explanation. Anybody know?
Posted by White_Niiji (anonymous) on April 26, 2008 at 10:53 a.m. (Suggest removal)
The Natchez project is jeopardized because of how the financing by our tribe was structured. We issued a bond of $50Million, $27M of which went to fund the Natchez casino. None of the other partners put up any additional monies. We are financing this from our main casino profits. These profits were already earmarked for programs on the reservation. Our leaders forgot this money was already committed. Now those programs are being shut down. Mr. Edwards states that no jobs have been lost at the casino, where he is employed, and that is true. They MUST keep the casino operating to fund Natchez. However, 1/4 of our tribal jobs have been terminated while none of the leaders have taken a pay cut. There is one exception, Muriel Fralick our Treasurer took voluntary leave. The other leaders have successfully petitioned for her removal because she single handedly exposed illegal financial activities, such as co-mingling of grant monies.
What the tribe need to do is stop funding the Natchez casino and bring back the money we sent down there. It is needed far more up here than in this investment. Our partners need to find another funding source because we cannot afford to do this.
Our "financial wizards" want to mortgage our tribal lands to carry us until Natchez starts making money. They truly have no idea what they are doing. We will lose these lands to fund a casino in MS. Why put that at risk? Why gamble so heavily with so much at stake? We were doing just fine without all these ill conceived investments.
Posted by freedom42 (anonymous) on April 26, 2008 at 11:02 a.m. (Suggest removal)
There are some of us who would gladly see the casino fold up and leave now. However, I have to say that the future casino does offer some jobs for our area, which is in bad need also. I can see what you are saying white_niiji, but I don't know if many people in Natchez will care. If your tribe cannot fund the casino, then it makes sense for your people to shut down any future monies coming in. Your people and their needs should be the main concern of the tribal council. Greed leads to bad and ill-conceived decisions on the part of all parties involved.
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on April 26, 2008 at 2:40 p.m. (Suggest removal)
It would seem to me the tribe has three options:
1. Stay in the investment in Natchez and risk losing the tribal lands mortgaged in order to do so.
2. Pull out of the investment saving the invested funds to rescue the tribal financial situation.
3. Sell your investment.
The first option is probably the most risky and unlikely to gain favor with anyone, but the other current investors and your tribal council that is underfire now. It is also the only way the tribe stands to actually gain from its investment.
The second option releases your tribe from casino commitment, but not the commitment of the bond issue, although these funds could go back to pay off some of the bonds. This option also probably kills the casino in Natchez hurting both Natchez and the tribe.
The third option would allow for the tribe to sell all or a portion of their investment to other investors, thus limiting their potential loss, but if they retain some ownership, they may also actually make some money down the road. This option also allows the proceeds of the sale to return to the tribe for debt relief.
Posted by White_Niiji (anonymous) on April 26, 2008 at 4:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Given the current legal entanglements, we may simply have to wait until a change of government occurs. Our Chairwoman, Victoria Doud, handed all our voting rights to Mr Bayba earlier in the year. He now controls our investment. This was done to circumvent the requirements by Miss. Gaming to obtain gaming approval. It was one of many foolish blunders we have made in the business world. As I say, Mr. Bayba is a good business man and he could not have picked a better partner than Lac du Flambeau-They GIVE him money and power to do with as he wishes. Again, his interest and ours are not the same. Our leaders simply think they are.
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on April 26, 2008 at 4:42 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Unfortunate indeed, the only hope for the tribe and Natchez is for the casino project to succeed.
Posted by ogitchidaa (anonymous) on April 29, 2008 at 12:58 a.m. (Suggest removal)
The only hope for the tribe right now is some federal and state investigations and indictments. Once the crooks are taken out of the picture then maybe Natchez will be able to move forward. I have a feeling that there will be nothing but horror stories for the months to come.
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