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Some expect low black voter turnout
Published Tuesday, June 3, 2008
NATCHEZ — Natchez polling places will be open from 7 to 7 today, but some fear one portion of the voting community simply won’t be represented on the voter rolls.
With no black candidates and an already defeated black incumbent mayor, black voters may not have the motivation to get out and vote, election officials said.
Overall turnout is expected to be lower than in the May primary, elections commissioner Larry Gardner said.
Photo by Marcus Frazier
Mayoral candidate Chick Graning pitches his campaign to Diane Williams at Wal-Mart Monday.
Only 338 absentee votes were cast — down from 376 in the primary.
“If you’ve got a low absentee vote, you’re probably going to have a low election, too,” Gardner said.
And that low turnout may be felt most in Ward 2, a predominately black ward.
Only five absentee ballots were cast in Ward 2.
Ward 2 Alderman James “Ricky” Gray who was re-elected by a landslide in the first primary, said the voters in his ward are disappointed that Mayor Phillip West lost in the primary.
Photo by Marcus Frazier
Jake Middleton greets Carol Smith as he and his wife Mitzi walk the campaign trail in Village Green Monday afternoon.
“It’s going to be a decrease in the total number of people going to the polls, but I think they might surprise some people,” Gray said.
“I’ve been encouraging the people in my ward to go out and vote,” he said.
Gardner said he too thought black turnout would be small.
“There’s not a lot of reason for them to get out and vote because all their horses in their race have either won or lost,” Gardner said. “I think that’s going to cut down a good bit of the voting.”
City Clerk Donnie Holloway said he expects only 30 to 45 percent turnout.
Turnout in the first primary was 45 percent.
But the grim predictions didn’t stop mayoral candidates Chick Graning and Jake Middleton from pounding the pavement one last time Monday.
Both candidates and their suppoerters were out in force campaigning, traversing neighborhoods and even greeting Wal-Mart customers.
Middleton defeated West in the Democratic primary by a little more than 200 votes.
The only other races on the ballot are in Wards 3 and 5.
Incumbent candidate Bob Pollard, running as a Republican, will be facing Democratic candidate Gwen Ball for Ward 3 alderman.
Democrat Mark Fortenbery will face Republican Charles Zuccaro in Ward 5.
Also on the ballot will be the hotel assessment — a $2 per occupied room tax increase.
The funds generated from the tax would be used to market Natchez and would be governed by a committee.
Residents of Ward 1 will vote in the City Council Chambers, Ward 2 at Frazier Primary, Ward 3 at Elks Lodge, Ward 4 at the Union Hall on Gayosa Avenue, Ward 5 at the National Guard Armory and Ward 6 at the Canteen at Duncan Park.
Comments
Posted by fatherof4 (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 12:19 a.m. (Suggest removal)
So, you are saying blacks are only motivated to vote, if someone black is seeking election? They only vote by the color of skin?
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 12:24 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Please vote...isn't not voting because someone of your race isn't in the race, well, just racism and just wrong?...keep an open mind...let's be Natchezians first...Natchez needs Natchezians to stand up for education, jobs, common sense...Chick is the guy to talk to and who will listen and take action regardless of race...after all what have you gotten out of the guy with 16 years of doing not much?
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 12:29 a.m. (Suggest removal)
fatherof4...I didn't get that from the article...what I saw was that the enthusiasm may be reduced because the favorite son didn't make it to the dance...don't play that card...continuing to play it is what loses the hand for all of us!
Posted by oldsaw (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 12:42 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Ever thought they feel that black candidates don't get a fair shake because of Kevin Coopers bias?
Posted by fatherof4 (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 1:10 a.m. (Suggest removal)
"Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 12:29 a.m. (Suggest removal)
fatherof4...I didn't get that from the article...what I saw was that the enthusiasm may be reduced because the favorite son didn't make it to the dance...don't play that card...continuing to play it is what loses the hand for all of us!"
I was just "asking" if this what the Democrat thought.
quote; " With no black candidates and an already defeated black incumbent mayor, black voters may not have the motivation to get out and vote, election officials said."
Sounds like they are playing the card, not me.
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 1:18 a.m. (Suggest removal)
fatherof4...my mistake...my apologies...although I don't necessarily think it was the ND, even if they did report it, I know they didn't have to, but the folks commenting made it something the ND couldn't pass up...it just kills me to think that we are hurting each other and ourselves so much with all of this crap...pardon my french.
This article could convince people not to vote...it's terrible editorial judgement in my humble opinion.
Posted by oldsaw (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 2:08 a.m. (Suggest removal)
sam, I think you may be on the something. Cooper knows that the article could convince black people not to vote. It is a terrible editorial judgement but what else is new?
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 2:11 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Natchez needs a unifying statesman, not a grant seeking constituent pleaser. When Natchez gets those, black voter interest will improve.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 2:16 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I bet if someone went around telling black voters they are going to lose their right to vote on water rates that would get them out to the polls.
Posted by oldsaw (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 3:29 a.m. (Suggest removal)
enkikur, do you think black voters are fools?
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 3:41 a.m. (Suggest removal)
no, why do ask that?
Posted by generoberts (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 4:53 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Outstanding article Kevin.......Keep up the great work!
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 5:53 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I think I see what you mean oldsaw. You think telling the black voters they will no longer be able to vote on water rate increases would be deceptive.
I don't think they are fools, but I know they have been fooled along with the white voters. As of last year the supervisors gave away that right to a separate political subdivision of the State of Mississippi which does not come under the jurisdictiion of the Public Service Commission.
The political subdivision, or state within the state, now has the power to set rates, service fees, and tax assessments for all water, sewage, and waste disposal in Adams County. It has been given special permission to go into the retail waste disposal business. It can deny anyone sewage service just because it wants to.
Right now, it is involved in secret contract negotiations with Rentech. My guess is what they are negotiating is how much Rentech can soak the citizens of Adams County for in supplying Rentech water and waste disposal. I would make that a secret meeting too. If Adams County rates go up, Rentech rates can go down. Plus, a signed contract could even become collateral for a loan for the Creek Authority, with rate and fee increases agreed to. I am just speculating on that part though.
i guess your alderman and supervisor forgot to tell you about it since you did not seem to be aware of it. They have been pretty busy, you know.
Posted by veroniss (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 6:30 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Racism is of the Devil,who ever plays that part Satan laughs at him.There will be no black white yellow or divided colors in heaven only.....Gods Children who know better than to argue.We as people of all colors should thank God we even have a Natchez.....
Posted by Swapmeet (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 7:37 a.m. (Suggest removal)
"Posted by fatherof4 (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 12:19 a.m. (Suggest removal)
So, you are saying blacks are only motivated to vote, if someone black is seeking election? They only vote by the color of skin?"
Look at the unusual excitement and turnout surrounding this years democratic national primary season for president. I don't believe it because of the dems political idealogy. That hasn't changed since the liberals hijacked the party in the 60's.
Posted by southernbelle (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 8:30 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Voting is a privilege we share as Americans. If a person refuses to vote for any reason other than just not being physically or mentally unable to do so , has no right to complain when things are going wrong in our government . People have lost their lives to assure us of that liberty ,and I for one intend to honor that right . VOTE NO MATTER WHAT !
Posted by natsanus (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 8:34 a.m. (Suggest removal)
The political process needs the support of all Americans. The ND need to focus on promoting and motivating people to vote. They should not provide them with reasons to stay away from the polls. Stop fanning the race fire.
Posted by voiceofreason (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 8:56 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Today I called the voter registration office to confirm my voting location for Ward 4. I was told that ONLY WARDS 3 AND 5 ARE VOTING TODAY!
This could be the reason we have such a low turnout of voters.
Posted by kpage (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 9:08 a.m. (Suggest removal)
oooooooohhhh, voiceofreason! Now that simplifies the subject! Did yall hear that?
I wish all of my Natchez friends the best of luck. I want Natchez to thrive so bad! May the best man win!
Posted by eaglebe (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 9:08 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I do not vote according to race or political parties. Since I turned 18 many, many years ago, I don't think I have missed voting. Even if I have to choose between the less of two evils, I go vote. That's my God-given responsibility, but I do have a question. If there were only two candidates running for an office and they both were blacks, how many whites would go out to vote? I know alot of them who probably would not. The nation is full of racisms on every side.
Posted by southernbelle (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 9:11 a.m. (Suggest removal)
natsanus , I hate to be the one to tell you this ,but the ND is not fanning the fire . It doesn't have to. The fire has enough oxygen to burn itself for many years . I had my head in the sand for many years over this issue because I wasn't raised to hate anybody , especially based on the color of their skin. But now....I still don't hate anybody because of their skin color , but I know we have big time problems in America . I believe our racial problems are bigger than ever and I fear a phsyical racial war right here in our own back yard . I fear the real Obama, if elected , will rear hisugly head and show America who he really is if he is elected our president . There are an awful lot of angry people in our society and an awful lot of them are black men . For whatever reason this has happened, it's not good . Think very carefully before you vote on this presidental race . Don't vote just because you believe it is time for a black man to be in office . Vote because you believe he is the right man .
Posted by sayitloud (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 9:21 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Sorry but YES...blacks DO only vote by color of skin...case in point Barak Obama folks! What the hell has he done in the past to be our Commander in Chief?
I'm just sayin
Posted by generoberts (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 9:29 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Concurr
Posted by kpage (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 9:47 a.m. (Suggest removal)
sayitloud...he ain't done jack sprat!!! Except make me suspect his true intentions. The anti-Christ warnings have me on my toes and running scared from this man.
He sat in the devoted and faithful pews of Rev. Wright's church, soaking up his racial spewings for 20 years before America cocked up an eyebrow. His hand in the cookie jar and mouth caked with powdered sugar, he denies believing as Wright does.
He still has Islamic blood running through his veins, regardless of his "Christian" ways in Rev. Wright's church.
So in one hand he has radical Muslim blood, on the other he has Rev. Wright's blessings. Come on folks, pick a hand, pick a hand. Wonder what prize you'll get!
Posted by sayitloud (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 9:57 a.m. (Suggest removal)
YOU SAID IT KPAGE!
Posted by humorme (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 10:02 a.m. (Suggest removal)
The reality of the situation is african americans as a whole have very low voter turn out. And those who do vote would naturally vote for a candidate they most relate to. This is not racisim its more ethnocentrism. The same reason the Irish Catholics all voted for JFK in th 60's. It only makes sense to support the person or group that you most identify with. It's human nature.
This presidential election year is very unique because Obama didn't get this far by only securing the black vote. Lots and lots of whites are supporting his campaign.
What many of us thought would never happen in our lifetime may be just around the corner.
Posted by natchezsouthside (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 10:05 a.m. (Suggest removal)
don't forget the old houses, welfare, WIC, lifetime public housing, stupidity, and laziness lovemypeople!
Posted by lovemypeople (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 10:06 a.m. (Suggest removal)
If you are not black then you can not speak upon what one's opinion may be on voting in any election. And blacks has supported blacks just as well as whites have supported whites so what's the difference. Natchez will always be hotels, gas stations, and the garden club
Posted by natchezsouthside (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 10:06 a.m. (Suggest removal)
My my my. Such BIGOTRY!
So what if he has SOME Muslim blood???
What the hell difference does that make--except to a BIGOT!
Go look in the mirror. Bigotry is UGLY!
Posted by lovemypeople (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 10:09 a.m. (Suggest removal)
NSS No I'm no muslim, but just like you feel about blacks and the canidates, I feel about whites and the canidates. So are you bigot
Posted by lovemypeople (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 10:09 a.m. (Suggest removal)
exactly humorme, If you can not relate to the canidate or personally know the canidate then some may feel what's the point in wasting gas.
Posted by sayitloud (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 10:22 a.m. (Suggest removal)
REALLY? If all you are voting for folks like yourself then tell me....how many of you are radical MUSLIMS?
Posted by lovemypeople (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 10:27 a.m. (Suggest removal)
personally I vote for the most qualified person and in some elections the most qualified person has not won but it do not discourage me from voting. I am black and I will vote today. I also live in ward 5. So am I voting for someone like myself?
Posted by rushinghjr (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 10:31 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Be that as it May! Everyone had better look down the LONG Road! Vote John McCain and the Republican Party! What do the DemocRATS offer! Owhamey and nothing! Need I say more?
Posted by rushinghjr (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 10:36 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Love-I like your attitude!
Posted by sayitloud (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 10:36 a.m. (Suggest removal)
You are so right rushinghjr! And do NOT let McCains AGE sway you! 71 today is NOT as it was years ago....he is very healthy.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 10:37 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Just to make the conversation more interesting, how many have considered that if Obama wants to be sworn in on the Koran he will be perfectly within his rights? His constitutional rights.
And I would like to tell everyone that I know two Muslims who know more about the US Constitution and US history than most Christian Americans I know. It is not generally known that what makes America attractive to Muslims, except for the fundamentallists, is the similarity between the bill of rights and the closing pages of the Koran...at least according to one Muslim Republican in Lousisiana (not BJ) who says that any religious view that advocates taking up the sword and killing people in God's name is suspect.
Posted by kpage (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 10:38 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Radical Muslims feel, no...LIVE for the fact that if we don't believe as they do, then God OKs them killing us. We DESERVE death, in their eyes and they don't mince words about it.
I was raised Catholic, so it would make sense I still have some Catholic beliefs imbedded in me...probably forever. But if I was raised by radical Islamic fools, I may still have radical Islamic beliefs imbedded in my soul. I realize there are sects of Islam that do not believe this way, and bless their hearts, but Obama was deeply influenced by not one, but TWO radicals. Does a zebra change its stripes? Even if he sits in Wright's pews? And since he got busted out in that fiasco, where does he fit? Is it only coincidence that he didn't salute the American flag or take his oath on the Bible? I'm just not going to take a chance. I've heard his rhetoric and it is so sweet, but didn't the Bible say that?
Posted by natsanus (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 10:41 a.m. (Suggest removal)
southernbelle do obama's white mother count? He is not just a black man. He didn't get where is today with the black vote. What do you think about the white Americans who voted for him? Just where is your heart and what do you wish for this country? Remember people of all colors has died for this country. I am a V-Vet. I love America and its people, do you?
Posted by rushinghjr (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 10:42 a.m. (Suggest removal)
That is my point EnK! The long road? People wake up-do you want to live in a 3rd World Country such as in Central America? Think of your future and your Children's and Grandchildren's. Think of America Also!
Posted by humorme (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 10:47 a.m. (Suggest removal)
How about addressing our economy, fuel prices, a war that has 4000 U.S. servicrmen an women dead, & forcloser rates that have jumped 110% in a year? These "simple" issues have the rest of America (and a few of us in the deep south) Questioning who is the best person for the presidency despite the party lines that have been drawn for us. Alot of people in this country are considering for the first time crossing their party lines and voting for not only a democrat but a woman or a black man as our voice. Amazing!
Everyone knows adams county and Mississippi are going to be won by the Republicans. There is much more on the line here than good ole fashion ideals. It's what is right and what is right for the country and the world. Think about it before you rush to the polls.
Posted by kpage (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 10:48 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I luuuuv me some V-Vets! No race thing here, nat. I say vote on the guy/gal who has America's best interest at heart. Just don't be fooled by fancy, schmancy words! You'll know who's pro-America by how he/she treats the Stars-n-Stripes...the ultimate show of patriotism!!!
Posted by rushinghjr (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 10:49 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Onward!
Posted by sayitloud (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 10:55 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I'm Democrat normally but since Obama is going to prob win the dem nod then I will go with McCain, this man is one impressive man if you search his past and he is also one hell of a great American that I would be proud to be my Commander in Chief sworn in a BIBLE!
Posted by kpage (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 10:58 a.m. (Suggest removal)
It's not the fact that Obammy is black...that's cool with me...color doesn't make the man. It's the pieces of his puzzle that don't fit. Big, glaring blank spots that leave the heart pondering.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 10:58 a.m. (Suggest removal)
To make the conversation even more interesting, I will point out that the Talmud advocates Jewish supremacy, and the Jesuit oath says all who do not convert to Catholicism should die.
The point of all this is that groups on earth vie for control of the land and the people. Think individually and with love for your fellow men and women, and honor the honest efforts of the people who gave us our Constitution to make a law system that lets all bridge the gap between groups.
Another thing, the Bible used to swear in Presidents is usually the Masonic Bible. Masonry is practiced in Temples to the Saints John. Masonry advocates the universal brotherhood of man. In Jewish Masonic temples the book on the altar is not the Bible, but the Torah. In Muslim Masonic temples it is not the Bible, but the Koran.
Masons stand cheek to cheek, hand to back, and knee to knee with one another. Masons swear first loyalty to the Worshipful Master of the Temple. How many US Presidents have been Masons? George Washington was the first one, though for the last thirty years of his life he would not enter a Temple because of what he called the Jacobin influence emanating from New York banking circles whom he called a "den of venomous thieves".
Posted by lovemypeople (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:01 a.m. (Suggest removal)
just cast your vote for who you think is right. if you cast your vote than you can say what is and what is not going right or wrong in our community or nation.
Posted by natchezsouthside (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:01 a.m. (Suggest removal)
McCain is 1/2 dead and is a dinosaur. The Republi-cons have sold out the USA for their own financial gain.
Obama is going to win in a land slide. All you racists/bigots are going to have to accept that a 1/2 white man will be the President.
Posted by kpage (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:03 a.m. (Suggest removal)
EnKiKur...that's another ballgame, yet so true. I could type my fingers numb about this brotherhood...the House of Rothschild...Skull and Bones...One World Government...etc. I sure didn't know the Bible that Presidents-elect swear on was Masonic! Bust my britches! There are so many secrets swirling around us that I'm sure it would unscrew our heads from our shoulders if we attempted to uncover them all.
Posted by sayitloud (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:05 a.m. (Suggest removal)
If you are voting for Obama natchezsouthside then please tell me WHY since it is obvious to me that YOU are the racist/bigot not me or these others since this man has done NOTHING.
Explain why you are voting for him IF YOU CAN
Posted by natchezsouthside (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:05 a.m. (Suggest removal)
If McCain wants to take the Oath on a Koran I have no problem with that.
Posted by natchezsouthside (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:06 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Presidents can take the oath on any bible they want.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:07 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Cute point natchezsouthside. hehe
Posted by natchezsouthside (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:08 a.m. (Suggest removal)
How am I a racist bigot???
I am voting for him because we only get a choice of Obama or McCain.
The country cannot take 4 more year of Repubi-cons and their destruction.
Posted by kpage (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:12 a.m. (Suggest removal)
But he's not Islamic! He's a Christian, south. Why swear allegiance to something he doesn't believe in? It would make him a liar.
Posted by natchezsouthside (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:13 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I don't know McCorpse personally, any mor ethan you do. How do I know he isn't practicing Islam at home????
The Pres isn't swearing allegiance to any religious thing when they take the oath. You swear to defend and protect the Constitution.
It matters not what religios text u take the oath on--OR if you use NO religious text.
I'd take the oath on a copy of the US Constitution.
Posted by sayitloud (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:23 a.m. (Suggest removal)
AND I haven't stooped to calling Obama stupid names like you have with McCain although God knows I have plenty of ammunition.
Posted by sayitloud (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:24 a.m. (Suggest removal)
natchezsouthside YOU called us bigots because I refuse to vote Obama, I say YOU are the bigot because it is obvious you are voting Obama simply because he is black.
Posted by kpage (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:25 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Yep, I'd take an oath on the Constitution as well, south. But I just can't get away from the fact that our country was founded on God, not Allah. And I can't support someone who doesn't have our country, founded in the name of God, in his heart.
I don't believe McCain practices Islam at home because he is a true American who actually defended our country with his life, locked up in a POW camp. Who better than he to be Commander in Chief? Someone who learned about wars from the books or one who actually participated in one? Old he may be, but wise...yes the man is wise.
Posted by natchezsouthside (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:28 a.m. (Suggest removal)
no sayitloud--reread what I typed. i am voting for Obama because of the chouice of TWO people. He is the not the warmonger.
At NO TIME did I say I was voting for Obama because he was black or McCorpse because he was white.
Oh, and I am white.
hmmmm.
Posted by drawpaintsing (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:28 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Ya'll at again, huh? LOL!
Posted by sayitloud (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:28 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Well said kpage! Wisdom and knowledge of what you have lived through is an advantage of his age.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:29 a.m. (Suggest removal)
kpage, think about this one carefully for a minute. And don't think I'm trying to rile you 'cause I'm not, I just want to illustrate what the idea of God encompasses in the minds of men.
Washington D.C. is in the District of Columbia. Who is Columbia?
Posted by sayitloud (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:30 a.m. (Suggest removal)
good lord
Posted by natchezsouthside (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:31 a.m. (Suggest removal)
OUr country was NOT founded by God or any other deity.
We are a nation that was founded on slavery, annihilation, and exploitation.
We do not have any pristine track record. We are not a NOBLE breed. We are savages. We are human. We are Americans. We are NOT the chosen.
So the @%#& what if McCorpse was in a POW camp. So were a lot of other people. That doesn't qualify him to be Pres.
Hell, Bush #@%^ed up his whole life and got into the White House. Go figure!
Posted by sayitloud (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:38 a.m. (Suggest removal)
natchezsouthside, I know you are black...go lie to someone else
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:38 a.m. (Suggest removal)
We are noble and ignoble, turn by turn, natchezsouthside. The actual founding of the country was by two corporate ventures, the Plymouth Company and the Virginia Company. They didn't have slaves in the very beginning, that came a little later. Jamestown nearly starved to death because the shareholders would not work. The indians saved Jamestown from destruction.
Posted by sayitloud (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:40 a.m. (Suggest removal)
boy you dream big don't you
I'm going to lunch so try some new lies while I'm gone will ya?
Posted by natchezsouthside (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:41 a.m. (Suggest removal)
well my white mother and white father would be in for quite a shock if that were the case.
Posted by natchezsouthside (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:43 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Well EnKi, can we call that the "founding"? Sure that was the settling of white people on the continent.
I was thinking more of the run-up and ratification of the US Constitution. We had slaves and we did horrible things to natives--not at all in a God-like manner.
Posted by natchezsouthside (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:44 a.m. (Suggest removal)
whatever, sayit, whatever.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:48 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Sure the earlier people did natchezsouthside. And those things continue today but it is less noticeable because people have lost the power of distinction they once had. The crime against the native americans continue today, but who advocates for them? All Americans work five months of the year for no pay, how is that not indentured servitude?
Posted by gottabehappy (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:53 a.m.
(This comment was removed by the site staff.)
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:57 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Lord, please help us. Forgive us for not understanding the responsibilities of self government to practice it well.
Posted by natchezsouthside (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:58 a.m. (Suggest removal)
is he running too?
Posted by natchezsouthside (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:59 a.m. (Suggest removal)
praise the lord and pass the ammunition.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:59 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Judge not lest ye be judged.
Posted by gottabehappy (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at noon (Suggest removal)
and forgive us for the ignorance we see in others.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 12:03 p.m. (Suggest removal)
This is your day natchezsouthside. You have had me laughing twice already.
Posted by natchezsouthside (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 12:05 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Indentured Servitude by our own hand since we keep voting back into office the same crooks and liars who heep the taxes on us.
Everyone complains about the govt but votes back in their own Sen or Rep. Well if you are looking for someone to blame check out that ol' mirror.
Posted by natchezsouthside (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 12:06 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I'm still laughing at that goofball who said i was black. Apparently because that is the only reason anyone could vote for Obama.
I LOVE it! HAHAHAHA!
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 12:08 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I am a political virgin, natchezsouthside. I'm saving mine for a candidate who expresses my point of view, and so far there hasn't been one to make it that far.
Posted by notfromnatchez (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 12:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Anti-Christ? Who's the Anti-Christ?
Posted by natchezsouthside (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 12:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)
not sure notfromnatchez.
I gotta vote for someone. Cannot "NOT" vote. So will hold my nose.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 12:13 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Christ is the light, so the Anti-Christ must be the dark. The Anti-Christ must be anything that expresses the dark side of human nature, so he doesn't need to run for election, having had rule for the whole timespan of man's walk on the earth.
Twice a year light and dark are equally balanced in our world, and we celebrate. Once each year light begins to dominate darkness, and once each year darkness begins to dominate light. It's the cycle of nature, an immutable law that must be obeyed.
Posted by notfromnatchez (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 12:15 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I keep hearing a lot of people say that Obama is the Anti-Christ and they are scared.
But the way I see it...if they are really christians they should welcome the Anti-Christ. That means they will going to heaven really soon.
That is unless they are worried about being "LEFT BEHIND".
HA HA HA
Posted by natchezsouthside (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 12:18 p.m. (Suggest removal)
how in the world does Obama qualify as the Anti-christ?
what are the parameters for qualifying as the A-C?
Posted by msfixit (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 1:27 p.m. (Suggest removal)
EnKiKur-the so-called "Jesuit Oath" is a viscious canard circulated by a candidate for Congress who was affiliated with the KKK in 1913. It started life as the "Knights of Columbus Oath" and snowballed from there. It was picked up by Jack Chick and his band of bigots and has received circulation from there. If you're going to make statements about Catholic related things, please check with someone who knows what they are taking about first. Here is a website with the correct information: http://www.geocities.com/okc_catholic/ar...
Posted by Peace007 (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 1:29 p.m. (Suggest removal)
If McCain is such a good practicing Christian, why has he refused to be baptised in his church? His own pastor told that in an interview and I'm sure if you do the google, you can find the article. So we don't really know if McCain is a Christian or is truly an athiest...do we? We know that he was in the military and was a prisoner of war in Vietnam. But did he, as Vietnam Veterans against McCain have said, sing like a canary while he was being held by the Vietnamese and use his status of having a father and grandfather high up in the military ranks to gain favors?
We also heard that Bush was the anti-christ and prior to him, Clinton was claimed to be the anti-christ. Just how many anti-christ are there? You can google and find articles about Bush and Clinton that will make your toes curl...check out the skolnick report. There was an article that I ran across once that said Bush was part of a satanic cult and that after he had gone missing for days, all the members of his cult had been found skinned, except for Bush. http://www.theonion.com/content/news/bus...
Maybe we should all just make sure that we are right with God and when the anti-christ does come, and surely he will since the bible says it's so, we will be ready for whatever the anti-christ and his coming entails. God is great (Allahu Akbar).
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 1:59 p.m. (Suggest removal)
You are exactly right msfixit. Anyone can say anything about anyone. Like the infamous blood lible used against the Jews.
It doesn't help though, that there have been many military organizations within all the religions. I have a few photos of Jesuits and the associated nuns carrying rifles in formation in South America, for instance. And of course there is the case of the Ustazi in Germany during WW II.
The problem with the monotheistic religions, but not just with them, but any group that has the same mindset, is that in those groups too many feel all the rest of the world must be converted to their way of thinking. And that conversion has too often meant conversion by force, if necessary, or destruction failing conversion.
Each group should be allowed to follow its particular belief system, for there is good in them all, but each should leave the other alone.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 2:15 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Shooting each other is not a convincing statement of brotherly love.
Posted by kpage (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 2:17 p.m. (Suggest removal)
The only comment I had about Catholics is the fact that I was raised Catholic and still have it in my heart. That's all, msfixit. That's correct information. Lots of love, fixit.
Peace and EnKi...the beauty of being American is that we can worship whom we choose and shouldn't be nit-picking other's religions or points of view. I'm guilty. Hang me in the gallows and call me strung up!!! ahahhahaha! Lots of love to yall, too, my friends.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 2:27 p.m. (Suggest removal)
It's fine kpage. No ill will here, I support freedom of religion, because most people involved are involved because of their good intent.
I have been thinking that religion and law both arise from considerations having to do with man's relationship with the land and the heavens. These things are common to all, and I believe this to be the basis of the common themes found in all religions despite the different dogmas.
The word economics means in its most basic sense "numbering of the earth". There is a verse somewhere in the Bible where God is admonishing men and saying something like "for who has stretched a cord over the earth?" meaning that it is in God's realm to measure out the earth and allot a share to each man.
Most of man's problems in dealing with other men comes from claims on the uses of the earth.
Columbia is God's wife, in the olden days she was known as Inanna, and then later Semiramis.
Love to you too!
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 2:36 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Does anyone know how the election is going? What about that abusive tax on our gracious visitors?
Posted by msfixit (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 2:44 p.m. (Suggest removal)
What anyone believes religiously is their own business, but when someone utters something I know to be untrue about my own faith I'd be a pretty poor exemplar if I didn't speak out, now wouldn't I?
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 2:50 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Yes, you would msfixit. What do you have to say about the Ustazi? And Vatican support of Nazi Germany in general? Do you have any thoughts on that, or do you put that part of Catholic history away?
Posted by kpage (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 2:53 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I'm gonna google Columbia, Inanna and Semiramis. Neat info, EnKiKur. Learning is my passion and I ain't beyond being corrected or redirected. I sure didn't know God had a wife.
Posted by kpage (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 2:55 p.m. (Suggest removal)
msfixit...did I utter something untrue about the Catholic religion? Please do speak out. I'm listening.
The Vatican supported Nazi Germany?
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 2:55 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Well, He did have a son didn't He? :)
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 2:58 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Rome is in Italy kpage, and Italy was allied with Germany. How would the Church have survived if it had been opposed to the Reich? The Catholics would have gone the way of the Byzantines.
Posted by kpage (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 2:58 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Yes sir, He sure did! I just never pictured our Lord having an "old lady". hahaha.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 3:06 p.m. (Suggest removal)
The heresy the Church was trying to root out during the Inquistion was the Cathar belief that Jesus and Mary Magdalene were married and had at least one child kpage.
Heresy means "choice" and the Cathars chose to believe a different version of the story than the Church.
Posted by kpage (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 3:07 p.m. (Suggest removal)
True, true. Points to ponder a la EnKiKur!!! And I passed that class two months ago. I guess you can fill me in where the university leaves off. Now I think of it, I should have used my noodle...of course Italy was allied with Germany. So of course, they must have kissed boo-tay to survive.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 3:11 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Many, many people in the US and Britain and Europe supported Hitler kpage. No one likes to admit it now, but at the time he was quite the rage. Like Leon Trotsky when he was the toast of New York before he went to agitate the Bolsheviks in Russia.
Posted by msfixit (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 3:15 p.m. (Suggest removal)
No kpage, I wasn't referring to anything you said, but rather to the mention of the so-called Jesuit oath by EnKiKur.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 3:16 p.m. (Suggest removal)
msfixit, all that sort of stuff are echoes of a day gone by. For the most part people of all religions have moved toward a more universal understanding. I did not mean to cast aspersions on you or your sacred beliefs, but to encourage questioning. Take a look at the past and try to understand how the people came to think in the ways that allowed the great atrocities of history to be committed. It always began with simple things that seemed harmless.
Posted by kpage (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 3:20 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I imagine many tooted Hitler's horn, even here in America. Just as they root for Obama today. I suppose many feel he is a breath of fresh air, as they did Hitler. Scary.
I'm on the way to the bank to exercise my right to freedom of banking institutions...sans a decent interest rate.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 3:22 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Have fun at the First Church of Money kpage. :)
Posted by doubled (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 3:22 p.m. (Suggest removal)
IM BLACK AND I VOTED....GO GRANNING...GO MC CAIN
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 3:25 p.m. (Suggest removal)
doubled, what do you think of the Board of Supervisors moving control of water in Adams County out of voter control? Are you going to be happy when the new water, sewer, and garbage rates hit and you can't do anything about it?
Posted by msfixit (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 3:25 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I'm not familiar enough with the Ustazi to make a relevant comment. Please suggest some scholarly references. With regard to Nazi Germany, on what do you base your assertion that the church supported Hitler. Are you aware of the anti-Nazi letter by Pius XI that was smuggled into Germany and that resulted in the arrest of a number of Catholic clergy? If the church was pro-Nazi then why did so many Catholics in Poland end up in the Death Camps? The Pope was still "The Prisoner of the Vatican" during WWII, and was very limited in what he could do openly. If you ignore the lies told in "Hitler's Pope", you will know that one reason Pius XII was not vocal about opposing Hitler was the network that was set up by the church to rescue Jews. He did not want to antagonize Hitler into looking too closely at what he was doing. After the establishment of the state of Israel Pius was recognized by the Jews as a "righteous Gentile" and honored for his behind the scenes work in attempting to protect the Jews, especially in Italy and Poland. I can't remember the author off the top of my head, but I suggest you find a copy of "The Scarlet and the Black", which is the story of how the Pope used an Irish monsignior who was the head of the Holy Office (aka The Inquisition) to smuggle Jews to safety.
My reading of Church History is NOT selective. I have taught it for over 20 years, and I'm fully aware of the blemishes. I will admit them freely, and anyone who doesn't has their head in the sand. However, there are many out there with an anti-Catholic ax to grind, and I will speak out when I see that kind of information.
Posted by Peace007 (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 3:37 p.m. (Suggest removal)
black woman who sued bush is found dead http://www.thoughtcrimenews.com/bushrape...
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 3:39 p.m. (Suggest removal)
What sort of Catholics were they msfixit? Were they eastern orthodox, maybe?
Try 'Genocide in Satellite Croatia' published by the American Institute for Balkan Affairs, and use the bibliography there till you are satisfied.
To get an idea of what was going on, I found this website with photos:
http://www.reformation.org/archive.html
It is true there are some anti-Catholics out there, I am not one of them. There are anti-Jewish groups and I do not belong to any of those either, or to any of the other anti groups. There is plenty of blame to go around.
I am sure the Catholic Church was playing both sides of the fence in WW II like so many others. When the outcome is unknown the only way to insure future survival is to play both sides. I am also sure there were good Catholics who fought to save both Jews and Eastern Orthodox Catholics, because good people the world over band together to help one another.
Posted by msfixit (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 3:45 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Thanks for the cite. I'll check it out. The Balkans have been a miserable mess for a very long time. I must go, however. I haven't voted yet.
Posted by drawpaintsing (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 4:35 p.m. (Suggest removal)
How did this discussion about churches and religion get started? Well, the bright side is, it is not a race war.
Posted by NtzMom55 (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 5:45 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Vote for Lavender colored people!
BTW, why is there so much attention on Obama being black? Isn't he as much black as he is white?
He's Lavender! ....and Hillary, well, she's just being a 'Hillary'.
Posted by doubled (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 6:36 p.m. (Suggest removal)
2EKK...LIVE WORK PAY MY BILLS AND BE HAPPY.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 6:57 p.m. (Suggest removal)
So you don't care if your bills keep going up and up and up and you have to work more and more and more? Won't that cut into your being happy time some? Or can you be happy working for free?
Posted by texasranger (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 7:56 p.m. (Suggest removal)
A fellow worker was my relief for some odd 20 years or so when i worked in the Labratroy at IP. I told him one day that he needed to get to work on time,since we didn,t get a lunch hour. Every minute past the half hour that he was late coming in the gate,put me behind getting out the gate. He was alway,always,20 to 25 minutes after the half hour coming to relieve his co-workers. When i questioned him about it,he told me that remarks i had made to him sounded racial to him. On a 7 day rotating shift i was working almost 2 extra hours every work week waiting on him. Wonder if sometimes that word is missused and run in the ground.It was old then and a lot of times it,s old now. Sometimes it doesn,t have to be about race. The problem really was that he was a sorry relief. If he had have been competition orange with a Dodge blue racing stripe, he still would have been wrong and orange. It really didn,t have anything to do with color.
Posted by rushinghjr (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 8:02 p.m. (Suggest removal)
EnK- GET READY!
Posted by sayitloud (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 8:02 p.m. (Suggest removal)
what was the outcome texasranger?
Posted by texasranger (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 8:02 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Veroniss,you ain,t ever had one for a relief.
Posted by Peace007 (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 8:05 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Sorry Enk, the hotel tax passed and Middleton won.
Posted by texasranger (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 8:05 p.m. (Suggest removal)
The outcome was their was no outcome. Ip had a lot of goverment contracts. They just mostly looked the other way,unless you said something to or back to that person.
Then they would find fault with you and call you a racist.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 8:08 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Thanks Peace, but I'm not done yet.
Posted by texasranger (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 8:13 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Why is it when your a sorry an lowdown drunk,nobody pays any attention to your color,your just a drunk,But you add color to it. Then someone can,t call you sorry or lowdown or anything really,unless you watch the comedy shows on cable tv. They call each other anything and nobody cares.?????
Posted by hopefloats (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 9:14 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Bet the turnout will be better for Obama!
Posted by picture_music101 (anonymous) on June 3, 2008 at 11:32 p.m. (Suggest removal)
This topic shouldnt have even been brought up Natchez Democrat! Its discrimination and the title sound bad i suggest deleting it!
Posted by natchezlady1 (anonymous) on June 4, 2008 at 12:25 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Upon checking out the comments left by the readers of this article, I find it absolutely astonishing that any article that pertains to blacks, crime, poverty, etc. would have numerous comments (mostly racist and mostly by the same few) and other articles that are not as "igniting" would have very few. Why is this? Why is everyone so ready to jump on comment bandwagon when there is a reference to race (be it implied or not). I have learned a sad fact about my fellow Natchezians and that is that many of them are closet racist. These are the same people we work with everyday, smile and laugh with, eat lunch, etc. It is awfully heartbreaking that we are still this closed minded this late in the world. The racist comments about Obama have unfortunately become commonplace. Surprisingly enough, black people are capable of voting for canidates whom they feel are qualified for the position at hand. Even more surprisingly, we could care less what color they are. This article from the Democrat only proves that some of our writers and editors are native sons of their beliefs and upbringing. This should not be a shock, at least not to black people. Had we shown up in record numbers to vote in the mayoral election, there would have been speculations into what our motives were and I assure you they would have been characterized as unscrupulous. Nonetheless, we as black people, black citizens, and children of God should know that we will be criticized, insulted, accused, belittled, judged, and analyzed to day we die BUT we should also know who we are and the strong faithful legacy we have endured from and do not let comments from cowardly "closet racist" affect our being and our behavior. Nor should we take offense to some of the reports our dear hometown newspaper reports. After all, we are a hot commodity for them (smile). On the issue of voting, black people should know more than any other race how grave and invaluable our right to vote is. Blacks were murdered because they desired the opportunity to vote and be heard. Please do not let this article attempt to belittle your ability to choose whom you wish and the freedom to not vote if none of the canidates are to your pleasure. Thank You.
Posted by sayitloud (anonymous) on June 4, 2008 at 7:32 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I have to agree that this newspaper tries to start the race war every chance they get.
Posted by drawpaintsing (anonymous) on June 4, 2008 at 8:40 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I agree, Natchezlady1 and Sayitloud.
Posted by gottabehappy (anonymous) on June 4, 2008 at 4:17 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Hey draws!
Posted by Peace007 (anonymous) on June 4, 2008 at 11:44 p.m. (Suggest removal)
texasranger, when my relief was late, past the hour, I would send him home for the day and tell him that I got it today, since you already made me late to leave. A couple of times doing that had him there bright and early from then on. If what you were referring to was your relief coming late, but still on time, a few minutes before the hour, you could have worked it out with the person you were relieving to relieve him late. Eventually, he would have asked his relief, "why are you relieving me late?" And, the person you relieved could have told him, "because you are relieving my relief late and that makes him relieve me late." You must not have known how to play the relief game.
Posted by Peace007 (anonymous) on June 4, 2008 at 11:56 p.m. (Suggest removal)
natchezlady, that is why Obama winning the nomination is such a great step for mankind. Obama being half white and half black, teaches every little child in America that you too can run for president if you so choose. Don't allow these few remnants of the klan to bother you with their sad clingings on to racism. They only hinder themselves and their own hearts from growing. God knows our hearts and when we all stand before him, he will recall every deed and unkind word we ever spoke. That's why I ask forgiveness regularly, because sometimes honesty can be unkind.
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