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Plans for St. Catherine Creek will go to Washington
Published Sunday, June 29, 2008
NATCHEZ — When the Mississippi River flooded in April, it gave the visionaries involved in the St. Catherine Creek Project an opportunity to see what the completed project would actually look like.
They used the opportunity to record footage via helicopter and boat and will use this as a means to sell the project to get funding.
David Gardner, city engineer and member of the St. Catherine Creek Project Committee, said he’s traveling to Washington, D.C., July 8 and while there will have a meeting with Sen. Thad Cochran.
What makes Cochran the senator to talk to is that he’s the chairman of the appropriations committee, Gardner said.
Also, Gardner said Cochran has expressed interest in the project and he’s familiar with it.
Gardner said he plans on showing the footage, which right now runs a little over half an hour but he said he’s going to pare it down and clean it up.
“We want to give him this video so he can see what we’re trying to do,” Gardner said.
Chairman of the committee Tony Byrne said he has already written a letter to Cochran asking for the $18.5 million needed for the first two weirs of the project.
Gardner said this will also be an opportunity to find out what members of Cochran’s staff the committee will work with in the future for this project.
“We’re going to Cochran to primarily talk about Tony’s letter,” Gardner said. “We’re just going to keep the flame going.
“You just have to keep plugging away and something always comes about. We always squeak, you never not squeak.”
Committee member Brent Bourland said he feels this will be a great attraction.
“We’ve got the natural resource and we haven’t ruined it with overdevelopment,” Bourland said. “It’s a form of ecological preservation.”
Gardner said pairing this project with the Natchez Trails Project, the Natchez Trace and the possible development of a picnic area by the creek would be a powerful combination.
“You’ve got one heck of an attraction here,” he said.
The plan of the project is to place five dam-like structures called weirs along the length of the creek.
This would cause the dammed portions of the creek to flood, essentially, providing enough depth for recreational boating.
An issue was brought up previously when the creek was seeing traffic, that increased activity would cause increased erosion of the banks.
Gardner said it would actually help with erosion.
“By putting in staggered weirs, it equalizes the water levels,” Gardner said.
Reducing water level fluctuation is key in keeping bank erosion at bay.
Also, the project is not set up in a way that would be conducive to boats with motors and will mainly attract paddleboats.
The committee was given $75,000 by the Mississippi Development Authority to conduct a feasibility study.
The first two weirs are upstream of Lower Woodville Road and upstream of U.S. 61 South.
The total cost of the project is $55 million.
Comments
Posted by oldschool (anonymous) on June 29, 2008 at 5:10 a.m. (Suggest removal)
AGAIN, What about out kids in this community. Why can't somebody build something for them........... $55 million sure is a lot of money for what already exist there already. I think this is way over priced and besides when this town can't afford to build something for our children to have a place to exercise their energy. come on guys think about this or get another project started for our CHILDREN.
Posted by Mucasplug (anonymous) on June 29, 2008 at 5:32 a.m. (Suggest removal)
What the Children need is Parents! The government cannot buy that. Libs think that we can throw money at problems in society and they will go away. No, they don't go away but it makes the Liberal heart feel better because they spent a lot of taxpayer money. Stop making babies out of wedlock. Stay home and raise them. Instead of watching TV help them with their homework. Instead of drinking and smoking pot in front of them talk to them about God and right and wrong. Its that simple Oldschool. Building parks for them is stupid and wasteful. Now, lets go forward with the St. Catherine project!
Posted by dynagirl (anonymous) on June 29, 2008 at 7:20 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Children actually CAN canoe and kayak; there could be lessons & summer camps at St. Catherine's Creek.
Posted by downhome (anonymous) on June 29, 2008 at 8:11 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Hate to tell Gardner but Cochran is not a chairman of any committee, he's a republican and out of power.
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on June 29, 2008 at 10:51 a.m. (Suggest removal)
downhome...heh, heh...good point, but I think David might have been looking hopefully forward to the after election position of the senator.
mucasplug...while I agree with many of your points, I strongly disagree that creating recreational areas for our kids is a waste of money.
I think that Natchez should look at the way Columbus GA has developed the natural wiers and manmade ones in conjunction with a riverwalk that runs for some 15 miles or so along the Chattahoochee River. It is very well done for bikers, pedestrians, picnickers and brown baggers, runners and walkers, fishermen and yes, even skateboarders and skaters. We could use some of the ideas to combine the St. Catherine project with the Trails and Riverwalk.
Posted by destiny (anonymous) on June 29, 2008 at 11:16 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I have to agree with Mucusplug to a certain extent here. Parents do not spend enough time raising their children now-a-days. Of course I'm an old fogey, but I'm proud of that fact. I was born in the latter years of the GREAT DEPRESSION and onset of WORLD WAR 2. We as children had no idea what a community play ground was in those years. We had play ground equipment at school but that was all. At home we fared for ourselves and with parents input made our own entertainment when not doing our chores such as raising our own veggies, yard maintenance, and so on. There was no metal to build playground equip. for the war effort took everything to fight for our freedom and liberty. Our parents explained why we could not have certain things and we understood. I hear constant complaints from parents who say their children have nothing to do.....Well..in a way it's your fault because you have not been the parent you should be. I know and understand you love your children and want the best for them. But sometimes you are not giving them the best. The best you can give your children is your time to teach them to fend for themselves, to respect others, award them when they do right, punish them when they do wrong. OHH, YEAH, they do wrong things and it's your responsibility to correct them when they do. You think you work too hard on your job to spend extra time with your children??? I could write you a book on how hard my Mother worked. She had a scrub board to wash clothes on and wash day on Monday consisted of up to 16 hrs and yet she still cooked 3 meals a day on a wood cook stove, ironed clean starched clothing for up to 10 kids with an iron heated on that wood stove, milked a cow twice a day, collected eggs every morning for our breakfast, I could keep going, but space here is lacking. The point is, through all this she still had the time to give us a hug when we needed one or a willow switch on our back side when we needed that. Never in my years with my mother did I ever hear the words GIVE ME A BREAK OR I NEED SOME SPACE. If my parents went somewhere without us which was very seldom, we knew something important had happened. In my prayers I thank God for the parents I had. They raised 10 kids of their own and 10 more that needed to be raised. That's the kind of parents we need today but are by far lacking. The adage, 'the world is different today than back then' does not hold water. It's not the world, it's the people on it. If you love your children, spend time with them. They grow up so fast. Teach them how to grow up. Take time to make great memories for you children. You, in your old age, will be better for it. Sorry to take up all this space, but I just had to say it. Have a great day everyone.
Posted by fatherof4 (anonymous) on June 29, 2008 at 12:44 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Page 1: Gas prices running over city budget!!!! What can we do? Where will the money come from?
Page 2: Lets spend 55 millon on a boat ride!!!
Posted by destiny (anonymous) on June 29, 2008 at 1:02 p.m. (Suggest removal)
fatherof4, so beautifully put. What else could be said after that????
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on June 29, 2008 at 1:48 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Hey, destiny, you put a lump in my throat!
Posted by freedom42 (anonymous) on June 29, 2008 at 3:52 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Thank you Destiny! Well said!
Posted by priya (anonymous) on June 29, 2008 at 5:03 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Here is my two cents for parents that want something built for children to do and than when your children get hurt there who pays the hospital bill or other damages. It looks like to me vidalia did make play on the river front for children but how many parents are there to watch their children so they dont get hurt. what happens when one of their children scrapes their knee! Putting a skate board park in or something like that and when your child breaks a bone. I agree make parents be parents to their bored children because if the town does anything to make a place for bored children to go it will back fire too.
Posted by oldschool (anonymous) on June 29, 2008 at 9:11 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Well I see it is just much of a bright idea for some folks in this town. I am a parent and I tend to my children very well. I am not on government assistance and I pay for their health care, I spend time with my kids, and the make damn good grades and I pay attention to them. I would like something for CHILDREN in this town. Hell from all the golf course, bars, casinos, SWINGERS CLUB for all the adults why not something for the children. You know that is why this town has no clue. Let me leave this before I loose my religion!!!! So who is watching your child why you go to a cocktail party, to gamble, to the squirral cracker????????
Posted by oldschool (anonymous) on June 29, 2008 at 9:28 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Oh By the way, bend over and CRACK me a smile!!!!!!!
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on June 29, 2008 at 9:29 p.m. (Suggest removal)
oldschool...whoa...a swinger's club?...news to me...is it really called the Squirrel Cracker?...please enlighten those of us who've never heard about this.
I also have to wonder why you group golf with casinos, bars, swinger clubs and cocktail parties...I'm guessing it's because you think golf is an upper class sport and just like cocktail parties or swinger clubs you think you wouldn't fit in so you condemn it...I have news for you...my father, a devout Baptist, a man who worked in the oil field all his life, never picked up a club until he retired...now he loves it and it gives him time to exercise, pal around with his friends, enjoy Duncan Park and the outdoors, get away from honey-dos if only for a little while...what's the harm in that and why do you equate it with the others?
It's all about people...people think differently from each other...just because you believe one way doesn't make it right for everyone. You condemn a whole town as not having a clue and then invoke your religion...seems to me that if you truly are religious you'd be a little more careful about your judgements. And if people have a babysitter and otherwise behave as responsible parents who are you to judge whether it's a cocktail party or a casino they go to in order to recreate?...the swinger club sounds made up to me.
Posted by freedom42 (anonymous) on June 29, 2008 at 9:47 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Swingers club? What? Where? Squirrel Cracker?
Golf is fun and a lot of kids play golf. We even have clubs we bought for the kids years ago in kid sizes. They loved to drive the carts - which of course they weren't suppose to do! I would love a mini-golf somewhere, but it would get destroyed just like the last 3. That's part of the problem with anything for the kids. The hoodlums come in and tear it up.
Posted by fire39212 (anonymous) on June 30, 2008 at 12:23 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Swinger's club..Wow i never heard of this...And it is called Squirrel Cracker? What a name....lol...
Posted by oldschool (anonymous) on June 30, 2008 at 6:48 a.m. (Suggest removal)
No I don't relate golf, cocktail parties, to RICH PEOPLE!! LOL Gosh yaw just keep on makeing me laugh. You just don't have a clue! This town is just a wanna B that is all. If you would read the comments earlier it voiced that people need to spend time with their kids and pay attention to them and don't say I NEED A BREAK! that is what I was getting too. Their are parents that tend to their kids and The Adults are the ones that are running from the kids. MY POINT!!! Gosh this is so elementry. and oh.....The swingers club I see you really don't fit in either.
Posted by fire39212 (anonymous) on June 30, 2008 at 7:22 a.m. (Suggest removal)
oldschool, Was just curious if it was true about the swingers club. Surely wouldn't wanna fit in there. Hope you do enjoy it though...
Destiny i have to say what a wonderful and truthful post you made....Parents just don't care it seems like..I have saw some in wal mart and lord how mercy if i would have even thought of speaking to my mom like they do..oh no.....Most especially in the public!!
Posted by southernbelle (anonymous) on June 30, 2008 at 9:14 a.m. (Suggest removal)
When children complain there is nothing to do it's time to do something . I've had grandchildren with me this past couple of weeks and they tried to play that song . I spent lots of time doing things with them and found out the real problem in their case was they didn't know how to use their imaginations on playtime . Before they left on Sunday , they had a secret hide out in the woods,caught minnows in the creek, hunted for some real neat rocks in the creek , went swimming, learned to ride real real slow in front of grown-ups on 4-wheelers ( a real feat for a couple of 12 yr. old boys)and eaten us out of house and home . We had a great time but I learned these kids needed to be able to figure out on their own how to be entertained sometimes . Being there is very important but so is letting kids use there brains independantly at times . St. Catherine Creek could make a lot of wonderful and beneficial memories for our children. They will need supervision and guidence ,and that is where parents and big brothers and sisters come in . Destiny ,as hard as your mother worked(bless her heart) I'll just imagine out of those 10 children ,at least 1 or more of those kids took on a mother/father role at an early age to help out . That's not altogether a bad thing but it does cut somebodies childhood short . That's another good reason for birth control .On the other hand, obviously somebody did a good job raising you,so who am I to say . Just an opinion.
Posted by momoftwo23 (anonymous) on June 30, 2008 at 12:31 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I know my two kids have imaginations out of this world and can easily entertain themselves. I just have to keep a close eye on them as to how they are entertaining theirselves because sometimes it consists of taking toys apart that can't be put back together. HA! Also, my oldest son loves the outdoors and fishing everytime someone will take him he is ready to go. And we go ALOT! He is always outside running around the neighborhood playing with the other two kids from the neighborhood and they never get bored. Washing cars, their bikes, just about anything.
Posted by Krogers (anonymous) on June 30, 2008 at 2:25 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I don't know much about the plans of this project. It sounds like a series of lakes caused by these weirs or dams that will be strung along the existing creek. It could be a good thing or it could be a bad thing.
But I know that expecting people to paddle boats, is ridiculous. It needs to be deep and wide enough for motorboats or it will go unused.
Paddling a boat in a pondlike body of water is hard work. These dams will obviously kill the current of the creek.
I am very familiar with St. Catherine Creek. From Butler's Lake to the last navigable point of St. Catherine's Creek is several miles of creek. No one can paddle that, I've tried in a canoe and it takes half a day to get upstream from Butler's Lake and if the wind is against you it can be very dangerous and very difficult.
I just want the creek left alone for the most part, but I would like to know more about this project before I make my mind up whether I'm for or against it.
I am very concerned as to how this will effect the St. Catherine Creek Wildlife Refuge. Will these dams slow down the water so much that Butler's lake will dry up? And in high water like we have recently experienced how will the dams stand up to that situation? It could be that this project would actually protect St. Cath NWR from high river water. That would be a good thing to stabilize the creek and Butler's Lake.
I tend to think that folks that want to get out and paddle a canoe, already have the St. Catherine NWR. We already have numerous National Forests, Wildlife Refuges, and Wildlife Management areas that are close to Natchez.
Where will this project actually be located? Will it be up near the city along the area where Hwy 61 crosses the creek, near the new location of Stines or what? I would love to see a map of the proposed project.
Posted by Krogers (anonymous) on June 30, 2008 at 2:34 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Ooops! Just reread the article and the ending mentions the location vaguely of the first stage. Upstream of 61S means that those of us living in the neighborhoods behind Parkway Baptist Church could have a lake in our backyard depending on how big a dam is planned for. St Catherine Creek is just past my backyard over there and if the creek is dammed and flooded causing the waterlevel to rise 30 feet my backyard could be flooded. I know that intense rains do cause flashfloods in those neighborhoods from time to time and we all depend on St. Catherine Creek to carry that rainfall off and drain on into the MS River. But if done right, this could be very nice to have a lake on the southside of Natchez. I want to see a map of the intentions of this committee.
Posted by freedom42 (anonymous) on June 30, 2008 at 2:52 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Krogers, I don't believe you said you couln't paddle a boat several miles! You're probably in better shape than me, and I know I can because I have. I'm not sure though, that this is really a great idea. I hope all the if, ands, and buts have been thought out ahead of time. As you said, it could be great, and it could mean disaster. Canoing is fun and relaxing, camping spots at either end would make a nice weekend outing for families. But I wouldn't want to put anyone in danger of flooding.
Posted by OldGrandDad (anonymous) on June 30, 2008 at 5:10 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Krogers, if you looked at St. Catherine when it was flooded at the hwy 61s bridge (near Stines), that is what they tell us it would look like. Except the flood waters were a few feet higher than the proposed water level. This project will not create a lake. It will be more like a bayou.
Posted by amyrenene (anonymous) on June 30, 2008 at 6:47 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I personally can't wait to see the project completed. I love kayaking and can't wait to go again. I've been in the river but would like a little safer area to go. I think it would be a great family outing and is great exercise!
Posted by Swapmeet (anonymous) on June 30, 2008 at 9:04 p.m. (Suggest removal)
It will be no problem getting the money for this little pet project. More pork barrel spending from Washington. It doesn't matter which party it is. They both are outrageous spenders. The funds for this project will be tucked away behind some huge bill for troop pay, or drilling for oil. That's the way they do it.
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on June 30, 2008 at 11:15 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Why not one big dam at the mouth of the creek?...backup St. Catherine and Spanish Bayou...almost everyone in Natchez would have lake front property then...LOL...just kidding folks.
Posted by greenupnatchez (anonymous) on July 1, 2008 at 12:18 p.m. (Suggest removal)
What is being totally ignored here is that the very end of St. Catherines goes right besides the proposed Rentech plant. What a pristine way to end a canoe trip.
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