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photo by Steve VanGunda
Natchez resident Dickey King speaks to other area residents during Monday evening's recycling meeting at the Board of Supervisors Building.
County requires recycling ABCs
Published Tuesday, August 26, 2008
NATCHEZ — Pay a visit to Poncho James was the end result of Monday’s first recycling committee meeting.
Poncho James operates Sumrall Recycling Services, and while he was not at Monday’s meeting, some think he may play a key role in the pending Natchez recycling program.
Dickey King, one of Natchez’s most vocal recycling advocates, said James has the potential to answer many of the important questions the recycling committee needs to contend with.
James’ operation currently buys and sells recyclables from areas like Columbia, Petal and Harrison County.
“He has a wealth of knowledge that we can use,” King said.
King said he believes James will be able to recommend what type of equipment would be needed, what products will be most lucrative to recycle and other basics for starting the project.
“He’ll be able to help us with the ABCs,” he said.
And the ABCs are exactly what Natchez’s Grants Coordinator Brett Brinegar said need to be established for the county and city to most successfully apply for grants to fund the project.
Brinegar said to write a grant successfully she would need to know how much money would be needed to start, what equipment needs to be bought and what should be recycled.
In a joint venture, the city and county could get up to $75,000 in grant funding to start a local recycling program.
“We need a basic plan,” Brinegar said.
To get that plan King and a few other recycling devotees are going to see James.
King said he plans to travel to Sumrall later this week and hopes to have all the relevant information ready to present at the next recycling meeting.
And if the next meeting, on Sept. 2, is anything like the first meeting, the recycling effort should succeed.
A crowd of about 40 filled the Adams County supervisors’ building to discuss several aspects of the program.
Adams County Supervisor Mike Lazarus, and half of the current recycling committee, said he was thrilled with the turnout.
“It was really great to see,” he said.
While no official action was taken on Monday, Lazarus said he believes the groundswell of support will aid the project’s success.
“We can do this,” he said.
And Lazarus is not alone in his thinking.
Monday’s meeting was sparked by a meeting last week when supervisors met with Mississippi Department of Environmental Quality representatives to discuss a recycling program.
Comments
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on August 25, 2008 at 11:48 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Follow the money...this guy has a vested interest in encouraging recycling...it may make money for him, but will it be in the interests of the citizens?
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 1:23 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Forty people out of the population of Adams County hardly constitutes a swell of support.
Posted by OldGrandDad (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 5:48 a.m. (Suggest removal)
In some countries all garbage is hauled to a dump and people that want to scrounge through the stuff for whatever they want are not discouraged. That seems the best way to recycle. I agree with the earlier posters on this subject who said they don't want numerous segregated waste cans in front of their house. I hear tell the UK is now putting cameras in the private garbage cans to enforce their policies. But then, they seem to have gone camera crazy......
Recycling is a good concept but not when it comes at a cost as high as that of the UK.
Posted by Doc_Fungo (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 7:25 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Poncho knows recycling! One other bit of Poncho trivia. He was the Golden Eagle mascot when he attended USM.
Posted by mike8427 (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 7:28 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Follow what money? This money that may come (if the grant is approved) is for the county/city. Mr King works for neither.
Posted by redusmfan (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 7:44 a.m. (Suggest removal)
O G D,
Recycling is not that bad. Just look at other towns that have done it. It will cut down on the chance of having a dump In Your Back Yard.
I recall a few years back when a company wanted to put a dump on Old 84 in Adams county and the neighbors went berzerk.......This would help that problem.
I am not an Al Gore fan, at all, but recycling is a small thing we can do so our grandkids will have more woods to go to and less areas that are off limits for garbage disposal.
Posted by OldGrandDad (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 8:02 a.m. (Suggest removal)
redusmfan, I understand your point. And I'm not standing against it. I just don't want to have to put myself out to any extreme for it.
But concerning the dump on 84, I was one of the ones against it. No one went berserk as I remember but we tried to get support against it. I didn't want it in my neighborhood and didn't want to smell it. Plus, I didn't want them to trash St. Catherine with it. As it happens, they are dumping stuff (???) there anyway and it does run off into the creek and leaves a distinctive and unpleasant smell in the water for miles downstream after a big rain.
Posted by redusmfan (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 8:10 a.m. (Suggest removal)
well,
If you do not want another dump close by, then get behind the recycling effort and stop worrying about how it will "put you out"....it will make sense. I know....it will take time away from important stuff as you have to seperate paper, plastic and glas....like blogging....lol....
Have a GREAT DAY ....( ARE YOU THE OLD TEACHER THAT USED TO TEACH AT THE TRADE CENTER?)
Posted by OldGrandDad (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 8:21 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Why you think I'm old? :)
But no, I ain't him but I do know who you are talking about.
Posted by rhymeandreason (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 8:30 a.m. (Suggest removal)
hmmm....natchez is 20 years behind the rest of the country on this topic. .digging in garbage dumps in the uk as an example, "follow the money".......geezzzzz.....are we so out of touch with the world? recycling is good for the environment, saves energy by recycling aluminum (one of the highest energy using industries) and makes for good public policy when we become stewards of our environment..i believe there are better examples out there though for startups of small jurisdictions. thank you to the organizers of this initiative -- long overdue.
Posted by eagle1 (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 9:23 a.m. (Suggest removal)
"follow the money"???? this is about recycling concerns. If somebody has the foresight in this business to make money, GOOD FOR THEM. Usually making money is the only way to get things done.
"follow the money" What stupid statement.
Posted by 3on23 (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 9:44 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Natchez is so behind the times. There are other areas more economically challenged that have garbage service that provides the large rolling cans and also a recycle bin. They have pickup once a week. The heavy duty cans hold a lot and also hold up to rough handling. I have to replace my cans at least every other year due to them being thrown on the street or back in the yard(if I am lucky).
Posted by Idefinitelymight (Tom Scarborough) on August 26, 2008 at 12:03 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Well stated, eagle1.
How anyone can in good conscience oppose recycling is beyond me. But I guess we're not called the "Dirty South" for no reason. It is perplexing to me that some folks discern in this push to reuse rather than discard some kind of looming attack on individual freedoms, or a sinister one world plot.
Recycling is an effective expression of responsible stewardship of our local environment, and our national resources. What could be more conservative than that?
Posted by c_8512 (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 12:10 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I recycle almost everything that can be recycled. When I was a kid, I walked up and down the roads, picked up soda bottles and redeemed them at the old corner store.
I never met Curtis Leow, unfortunately. LOL
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 1 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Tom, I reckon you are on the wrong side of the age spectrum to know this but "Dirty South" is actually "Durty South", a hip-hop group specializing in a type of music called "crunk".
Why must a one world plot be sinister? It could just be undesirable.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 1:22 p.m. (Suggest removal)
It's the incrementalism that is sinister Tom:
"Then there is the endless monitoring of small, everyday actions. That, too, is a feature of an overweening State and we have it here in abundance.
Yesterday, this paper reported the antics of the authorities who hounded a 59-year-old Essex woman accused of not disposing of her rubbish correctly at a recycling centre.
An official called at her home and then returned accompanied by a policeman."
http://www.express.co.uk/ourcomments/vie...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/essex...
It happens in the US too, this overpolicing of every aspect of life: http://www.alternet.org/rights/50939/
This won't happen in Natchez right? What does the blue house story and the Fat Mama's story tell you about the likelihood of this sort of insanity associated with recycling? It tells me this is exactly where it is headed.
Posted by aak1972 (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 2:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I think we should all try to recycle it truly is not that hard or time consuming! However, I think it should be privatized. Enkikur is correct about the overweening State. To be a democracy we are way overgoverned!
Posted by mike8427 (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 2:34 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I went and visited a Army buddy in Germany last year and he showed me that he was required by law to recycle. We laughed b/c in the states we think are overgoverned.
AAK and Enk, you might want to count your blessings, either that our try a differnet government and country. You might actually like the U.S. way of governing once you lived in say China, or maybe Cuba. Heck try out Mexico, I hear the gove there is A+.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 2:50 p.m. (Suggest removal)
If we keep going the way we are going mike we will be just like them. The time to stop it is at the beginning.
Posted by aak1972 (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 3:19 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Mike Im sure its bad overthere. No arguement from me on that . But you cant deny that its more overbearing than 20 years ago here. Buy a piece of property in the historical district and see what I mean.
Posted by aak1972 (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 3:24 p.m. (Suggest removal)
No matter what the degree it dont go over well with some citizens to be told what, when and where concerning personnal property!
Posted by aak1972 (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 3:30 p.m. (Suggest removal)
If you can honestly say we are not overgoverned and overtaxed I will never blog on here again!
Posted by iconoclast (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 7:22 p.m. (Suggest removal)
So now recycling is a threat to the Republic. EnKiKur, I thought you were going to get help.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 7:37 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Anything connected to ICLEI and the United Nations is a threat to the republic iconoclast. It's also a threat to whatever kind of national sovereignty any other nation has.
Viable recycling has been in place in the private sector for many years, centuries even, in one form or another. The feel-good brand is a relatively recent invention that comes on the heels of the idea that the people must be convinced the earth is in imminent peril from harm caused by humanity. That kind of recycling is bs and its proponents are primarily bs'ers though good, sensible people do get sucked into it either from sincere desire to do good or desire to be politically correct.
I'm not for anything that encourages mindless participation.
Posted by lookingout (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 8:46 p.m. (Suggest removal)
aak1972 and enkikur you are right on......If you want to recyle then so be it..If you don't then so be it.....If there are some that feels like everyone should recyle then they should go dig through peoples garbage and recyle.
Posted by Kaintuck (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 9:01 p.m. (Suggest removal)
This might be one of the more bizarre or paranoid discussions I've seen in awhile; and its about recycling... What a hoot! If recycling constitutes a threat of this magnitude to your personal "freedom", well, ooooh man - we better not do that!
I've spent months in Cuba (I know, that's not really a true regime like the one in Adams County, MS) working from Havana and Isla de la Juventud to Las Tunas Province, and you crybabies don't have a clue what a tough, authoritarian government is...
It is ludicrous to have a pedantic debate over the threats to individual liberty imposed by a recycling effort designed to benefit the citizens of Natchez. If you succeed in quashing the recycling effort, you can sit back with pride, take a pull off the ol' jug, and rejoice in showing those uppity do-gooders how a community should function - Weee, doggies!
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 9:48 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Well, you know Kaintuck, earlier this year the Democrat published one of their possibly award winning editorials about turning the lights off for one hour to help save the planet- the Global Earth Hour. Thank heaven Earth Hour happened or Florida might already be under water.
Earth Hour is sponsored by the World Wide Fund for Nature/World Wildlife Fund. Last year the WWF cited Cuba as the most positive example of sustainable development among all the nations of the world. Cuba is the example we should all emulate, according to the WWF.
All this malarkey, man made global warming, overpopulation, over-full landfills, man's eminent destruction is definitely tied together globally and blissfully ignorant people like yourself just don't know enough about it to be aware- you only seek to garner praise from likewise blissfully ignorant people. All of you should grow up and realize that there comes a time to leave mommy and daddy and quit seeking their praise. This is where the danger to freedom lies, in ignorance.
From the 1991 Club of Rome meeting, one of several meetings held since the 1937 meeting of the Fourth International World Socialist Congress where using the environment to bring about global socialism was discussed:
"Democracy will be made to seem responsible for the lagging economy, the scarcity and uncertainties. The very concept of democracy could then be brought into question and allow for the seizure of power.
In searching for a new enemy to unite us, we came up with the idea that pollution, the threat of global warming, water shortages, famine and the like would fit the bill. The real enemy [of the elites and their minions] then is humanity itself.”
The title of this document is "The First Global Revolution".
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 9:53 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Eagleone and Rhyme...yes, follow the money...I'm not against recycling nor am I against the ecology, but realistically it can't happen without the fiscal component...that's not stupid, it's pragmatic...calling pragmatism stupid is just, well, stupid!
Kaintuck...I don't agree with EnK often, but individual liberty is paramount...otherwise we couldn't "trash" each other here...pun intended.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 9:54 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Members of this group, the Club of Rome include Al Gore, Maurice Strong, Bill Clinton, Ted Turner, Jimmy Carter, George Soros, Tony Blair, Henry Kissinger, and so on and so forth. They actually do plan a global revolution based on the environment. They say so in their writings, they openly talk about it at the UN, the publish books, pamphlets, and web sites.
Preserve America, Keep America Beautiful, the Chamber of Commerce, nearly any civic or government organization you can think of is connected to this movement in one way or another. So, I know what I am talking about and I assure you I am not paranoid.
As I say, stay ignorant and let it happen. Feel silly happy every time the federal government sends a few more dollars to town through the NPS or the HUD to purchase your complicity. You want to create a better world for you children and you think the US is the greatest country on the earth? Then you better learn about the world around you rather than just slap each other on the back and praise yourselves.
Posted by Idefinitelymight (Tom Scarborough) on August 26, 2008 at 10 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Enki--your last post confirms that you have gone completely around the bend. The meeting that took place last night was a gathering of local citizens who joined together to discuss a very concrete and useful way to benefit our community. No federal, state, or local agencies are involved, though the city grants coordinator will be instrumental in securing grant funding to help the program get underway. This is not a matter of "creeping incrementalism" or "BSers" manifesting a desire to be "politically correct." It's a group of folks who care enough about this town to get off their a-ses and get involved. That is a concept that seems to evade the majority of the sniper gallery on these forums who prefer to sneer at everything from the safe perch of their message board anonymity.
To hell with all of you.
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 10:01 p.m. (Suggest removal)
EnK...if you hope to be effective don't overstate your case...otherwise you'll be like Ron Paul, who has some great ideas, but can't catch the imagination of the populace.
You in a bad mood tonight?
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 10:08 p.m. (Suggest removal)
No, just tired of the uninformed. i know who the ICLEI partners are and I know who the Education for Sustainable Development Partners and Collaborators are and I have no intention of going along with anything that is decided by a group of people from a foreign country operating under a body with the name Secretariat or Directorate.
I am a firm believer that we need to kick the UN and UNESCO out of the country before we end up in a nuclear war with nations who don't want to go along with this bull. Some powerful oil rich nation like Russia, for instance, so lately attacked by Georgia, armed and trained by us and Israel and NATO.
I also think we ought to cut Israel loose and let the bombs fall where they may so some sanity can be restored to the world, and the next time Europe comes knocking wanting salvation we should tell them to kiss our butts. I'm tired of paying taxes to save the rest of the world, most of whom are socialists already.
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 10:08 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Whoa...Tom, you sound like you're in as bad a mood as EnK...relax a little. I'd be interested to know what went on at the meeting....I also don't doubt your motives are sincere...I don't agree with EnK that it's a world wide conspiracy...Is there common ground?...can we make recycling user friendly and deficit spending free?
BTW...I'm not anonymous and my feelings are hurt!
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 10:10 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Heck Sam, go read "The First Global Revolution" and read for yourself who the members and sponsors of this are. All I am doing is talking about what others have written in their own words.
Posted by mike8427 (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 10:13 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Hey aak, sorry its taken me so long to reply. Of course this govenrment has it flaws, but it sure beats some of the others. I can't say I agree with all this govt does. Of course there are things I very much disagree with. But the difference is, I won't start bad talking my country. This guy you read above, Enkikur, would like nothing more that to see America collapse from within. He is a textbook example of what is wrong with society. He offers nothing positive, only negatively spun facts to try and turn all against the govt. Have you noticed he is always putting down this city, state and country. I am sorry, but I will never go with what this guy suggests.
Like to old country song, "when you are running down my country, you're walking on the fighting side of me"
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 10:15 p.m. (Suggest removal)
EnK...tact, man, tact...you can get the points across without seeming overbearing or arrogant...although, some here think I'm both. When you think ill of someone else just follow the comment with "bless their heart" and that will make everything OK, it's the southernese way...LOL
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 10:20 p.m. (Suggest removal)
mike, you are such a complete idiot I feel compelled to inform you that you are. I have done nothing but encourage people to investigate the roots of what we consider our rights so they will understand them. That is what the country is, a set of ideas about individual freedom that most all of you are willing to throw away so you can feel good about flag waving and congratulating yourselves.
Tell me, what are your basic freedoms and how are they derived? Do you even know? I know you do not. You have no understanding, like the majority of the population.
How many sovereignties operate in the US legally? Do you know? Do you even know what a sovereignty is? Do you know that there have already been federal court decisions that have upheld UN conventions over US law in cases concerning events that happened inside the boundaries of the US?
Heaven help us because we can't help ourselves. Global socialism may actually be our only salvation.
Posted by Kaintuck (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 10:21 p.m. (Suggest removal)
EnKiKur,
Marty, I must have struck a nerve. You seem a little upset, and strike me as bitter, spewing forth an endless series of diatribes composed of the most useless information this side of the Big Muddy. No doubt your goal in life is to win the "Big One" in a Trivial Pursuit Tournament. If only you could climb aboard a plinth, and don a toga, they would all come to listen, huh? Best of luck...
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 10:23 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Mike...I don't agree with EnK on lots of things, but I know him well enough to know that he is a patriot and want's the best for Natchez, Adams County and the US...I think it's unfair for you to question his motives...he doesn't want any result that you portray...he is conspiratorically minded, but it is out of concern not anarchy...he probably likes the song you cite a lot.
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 10:25 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Bless your heart.
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 10:29 p.m. (Suggest removal)
EnK...did you actually believe this: "Heaven help us because we can't help ourselves. Global socialism may actually be our only salvation."...man, go soak a lure, you need some relaxation.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on August 26, 2008 at 11:06 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Ignorance most always strikes a nerve with me Kaintuck.
And no Sam, I don't think that old Merle Haggard tear jerker is worthwhile at all. I think it represents the worst of our country, our submission to finance capitalism as opposed to true free marketing. That sappy commercialized version of America Haggard portrays would not have been possible in the days when the real America existed.
And as for you Kaintuck, it is not my goal to quash recycling. My goal is simply to warn people. If people want to be idiots, and apparently they do, then nothing should stand in their way. Nothing has stopped it in the past, human history is replete with such tales.
You are all welcome to be a bunch of green pansies and walk around with flowers in your hair and praise yourselves with your goodness like a bunch of Baptists fresh from reviling the backsliders on Sunday morning after the plate has been passed four times to collect the Lord's due and the Preacher's boat payment while the Preacher's daughter lies in a field dying of a self inflicted gunshot wound. Confusion, paradox, blindness- it's the human condition.
Posted by blogfather (anonymous) on August 27, 2008 at 12:41 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Recycling is great for the environment and all, but I can tell you some of the problems you may face that you will want to address before they start.
In the city where I am from the recycling centers have become the drug users best friend. They obtain these different recyclables by any means they can. It would be okay if they were picking these items up from the street, or when someone calls to have items removed, but they usually don't. They obtain these recyclables from pillaging through our trash cans causing us to shred everything for fear of identity theft. Anyway, who wants a stranger looking through their trash. (especially women) A person can learn a lot about you by looking into your trash. (time of month, type of medicine used, types of foods eaten, ect.)
Other ways people obtain recyclables is from theft. You'd better protect schools, and any other places that have aluminum pipes and copper wires. You'll remember what I'm saying the first time you see someone pushing a shopping cart full of bottles , cans, and other pieces of metal down the street. Lately, I have even noticed that the people looking through the trash cans on the street are also looking into vehicles (checking their stereo systems out , I think).
Posted by mike8427 (anonymous) on August 27, 2008 at 7:48 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Sam, you think Enk is a patriot? Who or what is he a patriot to? He was comparing recycling in the U.S. to Hitler and the Holocaust in the previous article on recycling.
Posted by mike8427 (anonymous) on August 27, 2008 at 8:18 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Sam, if you get the time, watch this. Its a little long but good and it is what a patriot is - http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=...
Posted by Bobaloo (anonymous) on August 27, 2008 at 11:31 a.m. (Suggest removal)
according to Enk..... recycling is a conspiracy...... what?
that's whacked!!
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on August 27, 2008 at 12:05 p.m. (Suggest removal)
No, Bobaloo, a conspiracy is done in secret. Agenda 21 is being done openly. Recycling is just a way to begin the process of acceptance through an apparently legitimate sounding program to improve the environment.
If you go back and read the Linda Gummow Letter to the Editor about the meeting with the DEQ you will note who she said attended, Waste Management, Chamber of Commerce, Keep America and Keep Mississippi Beautiful.
All these groups are ICLEI partners. ICLEI is the International Council for Local Environmental Initiative which is the body responsible for enacting Agenda 21. Agenda 21 is a forty chapter plan for controlling all of earth's resources at an international level through gaining local compliance:
"Local governments and their associations constitute ICLEI's global membership. As a democratic, membership-driven association, every member has a vote at council meetings where the priorities and direction of the organization are determined. Governed by the ICLEI global charter put in place by its founding members, our mandate is to build an active and committed membership of local governments" http://www.iclei-usa.org/about-iclei/icl...
In all likelihood local members of these groups have never heard of ICLEI or Agenda 21 and I would be willing to bet that most members of the Chamber of Commerce don't even know the Chamber is an international organization. These local members just promote the programs presented to them from above, probably without investigating the who, why, or where the programs come from:
"ICLEI USA is part of an international organization that operates 13 offices on 7 continents. The ICLEI global network works on clean energy, climate protection, biodiversity, sustainable procurement and water issues."
This is exactly what was described in the COR book "The First Global Revolution", using the environment to promote collectivism.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on August 27, 2008 at 12:14 p.m. (Suggest removal)
What is collectivism? Most locals probably don't know that either. Collectivism in its most pragmatic example is what occured after Lenin's rise to power following the Bolshevik Revolution. The Red Army, in the name of the People's Revolution, went around from farm to farm collecting part of the grain grown by individual farmers. That is collectivism, taking from individuals for the benefit of the state.
Next time around the Red Army took all the grain, then next time around all the grain and all the seed and all the farming implements. 'What occured after this was massive famine in the USSR that led to the deaths of five million peasants through starvation, all for the good of the people.
The reason Lenin did this was to teach the Russian people that God could not save them from starvation but the State could. The Russian people learned pretty quick to comply and many began to inform on their neighbors for real or imagined dissent against Marxist philosophy and this led to the brutal deaths of an additonal 50 million in Russia, all in the name of the common good.
If you have any idea what Marxism is you would realize that Agenda 21 is Marxism. It may be cleaned up and look sweeter but it looked that way the first time around. There is good reason to learn how propaganda is populated among the public through the most harmless seeming methods.
Posted by eagle1 (anonymous) on August 27, 2008 at 12:27 p.m. (Suggest removal)
EnK, seriously, while I somewhat understand.....really, it was just a simple meeting on recycling and nothing more. I think you are WAYYYYYY out there. There was nothing about compliance issues mentioned, just ways to reduce the waste stream into our local landfills. Quite simple and elementary.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on August 27, 2008 at 12:56 p.m. (Suggest removal)
eagle, if they started off saying this was going to be mandatory and oppressive in the beginning it would not get off the ground. What they said at the first meeting was this is "Phase I", so there must be a "Phase II" and beyond- that is how it has gone around the country.
It was also said that at every stage recycling would be completely voluntary. Anyone familiar with the sustainable development movement, of which recycling is a part, instantly would recognize what "voluntary" means. It means not a simple vote, but high pressure tactics, media promotion, social pressures exerted to form "consensus". If only a few well placed people go for it that will be taken as consensus and voluntary consent of the whole population. There is even a formal method for developing consensus; I am familiar with it and the techniques to use to combat it.
If you care to spend a couple of days reading about recycling programs in various cities you will find cities all across the country in the various stages from voluntary to mandatory.
In order for Agenda 21 to work it has to be accepted by people at the local level. Agenda 21 calls itself a 'global to local' program, meaning global management through local control. To get that local control people must be educated in the new environmental ideologies, and that is why the decade 2005-2015 has been designated the "Decade of Education for Sustainable Development". If you don't believe me, look it up.
True to Marxist philosophy God cannot save us from global warming, but scientific management can. While it may seem that this recycling is just some local people honestly wanting to do something good, I assure you there is far more to it. Why didn't they have this idea ten years ago, or five? Why now?
Since 1996 the International Chamber of Commerce, in order to retain its special consultative status with the UN's Economic and Social Council has been under agreement whereby it must "be in conformity with the spirit, purposes and principles of the Charter of the United Nations" and that the organizations "shall undertake to support the work of the United Nations."
Since the Charter of the UN says that humans have only those rights that are not at cross puposes to the aims of the UN most local members of the Chamber would be shocked if they understood the relationship of the International the UN and the implications of that relationship.
The South is a special case in regard to sustainable development in that here moreso than in the rest of the US except for some states in the west, people have retained an intuitive though not well understood sense of individual rights and distrust of socialism when it is identified as such. Any such programs, and there are many programs in line with sustainable development underway in Mississippi at the moment, must be carefully and slowly implemented or the people will recognize and resist.
Posted by mike8427 (anonymous) on August 27, 2008 at 1:55 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Enk, Please keep writing this. The more you type, the more you prove the point that you are not right in the head.
Sam, do you still actually listen to this guy? When I read his stuff, it is almost like listening to that Rev Jeremiah Wright. Makes no sense at all, just a bunch of crap to get people fired up for the wrong reasons. Are you his Obama?
Posted by aak1972 (anonymous) on August 27, 2008 at 2:06 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Mike I do love this country but like it or not the U.S. government wants to control evry aspect of your life. And they will sell it to us as a convenience. They are pushing for a cashless society so every time you use your card they will know what where and when. Like it or not read your Bible this will happen in the next 20 years!
Posted by aak1972 (anonymous) on August 27, 2008 at 2:06 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Mike I do love this country but like it or not the U.S. government wants to control evry aspect of your life. And they will sell it to us as a convenience. They are pushing for a cashless society so every time you use your card they will know what where and when. Like it or not read your Bible this will happen in the next 20 years!
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on August 27, 2008 at 2:18 p.m. (Suggest removal)
"Each class that takes part in the program becomes an “Earth Village,” and within this village the students each take on a role. There is a “Little Village Leader” who is responsible for the coordination of the village’s activities; a “Little Environmental Expert” who researches answers to questions the village members have about the environment; some “Little Hand in Hand Journalists” who promote the program through newsletters and bulletins; a “Little Recycling Station Manager” who tallies, weighs and records the recyclable materials brought in by each student; and “Little Village Recycling Bank Accountants” who calculate and record the money that is earned each time materials are taken to the recycling depot. These are all elected positions and are supported by an advisory committee made up of the principal, teachers, parents, and members of the community."- page 80 'Green Teacher Magazine' http://www.greenteacher.com/MagsDownload...
The excerpt above is about environmental education in China and is a cute "little" program. Green Teacher is a US publication though, a partner with the US Partnership for Education for Sustainable Development, targeted at the K-12 initiative.
All socialist regimes have attempted to educate the children into their ideologies at as early an age as possible. The green agenda is truly a global drive, a global ideology. And all across the globe children are being educated into it. Think how strong the religious teaching you received as a child is; the intent is to make this green education just that strong, as strong as religion and religious groups are even being used to help implement. The Presbyterian Church for instance, has an Environmental Justice Office.
I don't know, maybe we can replace all the world's divisive religions with reverence for the environment and achieve world peace through united social effort as eco-stewards in a Marxist political system. That is certainly the intent of Agenda 21 and Education for Sustainable Development. There are some enticing parts to the vision- no hunger, no lack of shelter, water for all, universal medical care, no unemployment (you'll be assigned a job in management, production, agriculture, or environment).
Don't think for one minute though that this recycling is an isolated local effort. It is not. Don't think this movement is not already affecting you either. Most of you know Entergy is asking for a rate increase now to build a nuclear plant in the future and will probably get it. Did you also know that Entergy is in partnership with the US Forest Service to take agricultural land out of production in the Mississippi Valley and "carbon farm" it? You'll help pay for that too. And once properly educated socialism will seem as natural to you as whatever political system you think you are living under now.
Posted by EnKiKur (anonymous) on August 27, 2008 at 2:51 p.m. (Suggest removal)
You are pretty funny mike. I am speaking against socialism, as always, and for some reason you think I am speaking for it. Reactions like yours are probably the soundest argument against democracy. You just don't understand much about economic or political systems. It wouldn't make much difference to you which of either you lived under as long as the majority went along with it.
Posted by Bobaloo (anonymous) on August 27, 2008 at 5:23 p.m. (Suggest removal)
what a waste of intelligence.......
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on August 27, 2008 at 7:02 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Indefinitely might...no, I didn't really get upset or hurt...I was just responding to your comment about anonymity and the last comment. You know that although we often disagree I respect your opinion and intellect.
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on August 27, 2008 at 7:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)
mike...sure I listen to EnK, just as I listen to many fellow bloggers...then I research if necessary what they say...deliberate, cogitate, ruminate and only then do I berate and excoriate...LOL.
Seriously, I've corresponded with him enough to know his motives if not always his humor or thought process. Similar to the way I feel about you, Indefinitelymight, Babaloo, Peace, Yeahuhuh and others, I value his input into the dialog even if I don't always agree and it is a bit long-winded and over-the-top sometimes.
Posted by sammohon (anonymous) on August 27, 2008 at 7:51 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Mike...thank you for the video link...it was wonderful, I highly recommend it and am posting it here again even though it's off topic.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=...
Thanks again!
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